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To Fit or not to Fit a Waste ink Tank on a Canon Printer ?

Discussion in 'Everything Else InkJet Printer Related' started by The Hat, Sep 21, 2013.

  1. Sep 25, 2013
    mikling

    mikling Printer VIP Platinum Printer Member

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    If the pump were to be actually taking ink out while you heard it running each and every time, your cartridges would empty so fast you'd have a heart attack or be afraid to even turn it on. Which is what happens to many people using OEM carts. A lot of the volume pushed is air. The ink at the lowest point is not of concern as the likelihood of that drying is next to nil especially with the loop. Immediately when the tube exits the printer, put on the loop, make it about as high as the CISS tank or if using carts lower than the carts. The loop will allow slack for handling the tank and also serve a useful purpose at the same time. After all, if it was sitting flat on the table it would be taking space up anyways. Might as well loop it up and stick it on the side out of the way. Neat and functional. If you have lots of extra tubing, just loop it all neatly.
     
  2. Sep 25, 2013
    jtoolman

    jtoolman Printer Master Platinum Printer Member

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    I will share a little problem I did have with one of my setups.
    This R1900s that had an external bottles sitting next to it.
    Actually this printer was the lowest of several on a rack system. So the bottle actually sat on the floor whicih is about 2.5 inches lower that it would be if it was sitting on the shelve next the printer.

    I found that I needed to run a cleaning cycle so I proceeded to do so.
    I then ran a second test and there were globs of ink along the print.
    I looked inside and indeed the purge pad was SATURATED with a waste ink.
    I ran another cycle and noticed that ink was clearly being drawn out through the print head but during the actual purging part of the process, NO INK was being suctioned out. It simple stayed there.

    I had to disconnect the line from my bottle. Attached a syringe to it, and sure enough, I could not draw ink into the syringe.
    I have an ink clog inside the tube somewhere.
    Careful applications of Windex on the purge pad and gentle pressure, black and forth with the syringe, effectively cleared the clog. I continues the Windex application and drawing out the fluid with the syringe until all that was coming out was blue Windex.
    Reconnected the line to the bottle and it's been many months and the problem has never returned.

    So yes, a blob of ink trapped along the tub may have caused this. Can't think of another source of this problem.

    Joe
     
  3. Sep 25, 2013
    mikling

    mikling Printer VIP Platinum Printer Member

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    Why as high as the tank? if for any reason, a siphon effect occurs, it will stop at the top of the loop. At least all the ink won't be gone from your tank. Then you'll be able to solve your problem with the CISS....and still have ink left. If the tank and tubes were not to have the crest, the next day you could have an overfilled external tank with ink all over the table if the vent hole is lower than the tank. It's a safeguard that won't hurt. But with any proper CISS installation, siphoning should not occur...but things happen. So that also gives you a guideline for choice of the external waste ink tank height. You want it NOT to be lower than the ciss tank or should I say the combined height of the crest and bottle. All useful tidbits.
     
  4. Sep 25, 2013
    jtoolman

    jtoolman Printer Master Platinum Printer Member

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    Mike I think you maybe meant to reply to the CISS post not this one?
     
  5. Sep 25, 2013
    mikling

    mikling Printer VIP Platinum Printer Member

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    I have long forgotten to mention this but a periodic application of Windex on the purge pad to clear out the purge pads is something I would recommend on pigment printers. A lot of pigment settles in those pads... even with OEM inks. When I acquire used pigment printers that is one task I perform. I soak the pads in windex and suck out all the pigment with a vacuum tool. A LOT of pigment is stuck in there. As I put windex ink with one hand I have the vacuum in the other. Just like the dentists does in your mouth when they wash it with the vacuum. I rinse it out till it is like new and void of color.
     
  6. Sep 25, 2013
    mikling

    mikling Printer VIP Platinum Printer Member

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    You were replying as I was replying and you posted first, so it is out of sequence.
     
  7. Sep 25, 2013
    websnail

    websnail Printer VIP Platinum Printer Member

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    Following on from The Hat's post earlier in relation to the maximum height of the tube... It can have a negative effect albeit not necessarily pooling in the tubing. There are also a few potential gotchas in using a loop as well, so some lessons I've learned from practical experience.

    1. As with any kind of tube bend, make sure the loop is not too tight or ensure it it supported (coiled round something). Otherwise the bend/loop could fold/crimp and "block" the tube.

    2. On the opposite end of the scale, make sure the loop isn't too tall or you'll just be creating the exact same problem as a waste ink tank with a high entry point.

    3. Any loop needs to be able to counter any backflow from tubing that extends to a tank taller than the loop itself. With sufficient height, ink could retreat back and return over a loop too.

    Basically, don't loop any old way/size, but think about, test and check it's working..


    Next up, a critical factor beyond tube diameter is the material and internal surface. There's a very good reason I don't use the same crappy ribbon tubing you get with CIS systems. Anything that allows ink to adhere to it, runs the risk of ink sticking to the walls and building up over time until it promotes and forms a clog in the tube.

    The ink/air purge does do its best to flush out the tubes but there is always some ink left, so it can indeed drift back towards the resting/cleaning pad if there's enough of a egress from a tube that goes high.

    Having discussed this with a number of customers who've experienced printhead soiling issues from other waste ink kits (many based loosely around a 100ml/4oz bottle standing up) it seems issues tend to happen more with printers that have seen a pretty long service and are likely getting worn parts. The pump would be no exception so some ink can migrate back, sit in the resting pad and start a long process of slowly building up ink deposits on the printhead that dry on and eventually cause repeated nozzle clogging, etc...

    It's easy to assume any issues would be akin to the great flood... Slow, insidious issues are much worse because the problems start small and build.



    Luckily mitigation is pretty easy and while the loop idea should work, it'd be as easy to take the industrial velcro approach and use it to mount the tank on the desk side with only 1/2" (1cm) proud of the desk. If need be you could use a metal book end to act as the desk side and provide a mount point (say for a shelf located printer)
    However! The tube would have to be connected to your tanks opening and not extend into the bottom of the tank or you are risking a syphon.




    My last point is this... There has been a substantial amount of generalisation in this thread so I'd recommend some caution.

    There has been a lot of changes made to printer designs since the old R300 when external waste ink tanks started catching on. It would be lovely to think that Canon printers would act the same way as Epsons, as Brothers and so on... but the truth is that there are variation in inks, ink combinations (eg: pigment + dye in 5 ink Canons), inkjet processes (Epson vs' bubblejet), waste ink volumes and more besides. Variation between printer models within a brand is also evident (Canon iP4000's vs' iP7250 for example). There's a very real danger of assuming "one size fits all" akin to "Universal ink" and we all know how that works out...

    The old saw of "ass-u-me" applies and it's for this reason I've been very cagey about the use of Printer Potty kits (designed for Epson inkjets) applied to two Canon printers.

    Ultimately though direct experience is more telling than just plain old theory so doubtless there will be plenty more to this thread, most likely in the form of "Don't do X.. I need a new carpet!" ;)

    Just my 10 penneth + lunch...
     
  8. Oct 18, 2013
    The Hat

    The Hat Printer VIP Moderator

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    Another up-date on the Canon waste tank issue.

    I have just fitted a Potty waste tank to my iX4000 dye printer and two day in it’s working as expected.
    I think these things could be habit forming because this is my third one to fit onto my printers
    but honestly I couldn’t be happier with them and don’t know why I ignored them for so long.. :love
     

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