[Research] Canon printers - refill/CIS capable

[websnail]

This thread is an attempt to restart an earlier topic but with a lot more clarity.

Explanation:
There is a rumour from a good quality source that some Canon printers (specifically the iP4300) have been programmed with a firmware that does not allow the user to accept the use of non-OEM or refilled cartridges using the standard 3-warnings warranty-void procedure.

Goal:
To identify which Canon printers CAN be used with non-OEM or refilled cartridges.

Criteria:
Printers are considered capable when at least 3 users have reported their printer will function with all cartridges recognised as "empty" and have the ink detection levels turned off for more than a week.
If a printer is identified as not being resettable or unable to work with one or more of the cartridges as being "empty" then it goes in the "possible" list even if success has been ID'd by other users.

Results: (This will be kept updated with the results reported)

Confirmed/Assumed* Working:
- iP4200 (multiple reports)
- iP5200 (websnail)*
- iX4000 (websnail, pharmacist)*
- iX5000*
- MP500 (websnail - multiple machines)
- ip1600 (smile)
- ip6600D (smile)
- ip6700D (smile)

*Printers are assumed to be working that have been in use for around a year with no reports at all of problems

Unknown: :|
- iP4500 (Pharmacist [works])
- MP510
- MP600 (Bill [works])
- MP610
- MP810
- MP970
- MX700 (Websnail [works])

Problems reported:
- iP4300 WORKS: WebSnail ,Tin Ho, Manuchau/Atlantic Inkjet
- iP4300 FAILS: MIS [fails]


Note:
If you need to discuss or clarify what constitutes a good or a bad result then please post in the [Comments] separate thread so we can deal with the issue there and update this thread as necessary.. This is not hard science but more a user poll to try and get some relatively solid experience behind us rather than putting too much weight on rumour and supposition.

 

[Marine]

As far as I can tell the issue with the iP4300 started approx 1 month into production. The vary first printers that were produced will reset using the method outlined in the user manual. Approx 1 month into production of the printer the reset procedure was removed from the firmware, and the printer manual.

It would appear that the easiest way to see if your printer will work would be to check your manual to see if it has the Ink Monitor Disable procedure. One of my resources has found all printers that have been released after the iP4300 to be missing the firmware that allows for the ink counters to be disabled. This source also produces a commercial Canon chip resetter that integrates into the printer ($700), and he noted that Canon included code in thier firmware that prevents his resetter from working with these models.

It would appear that the only way around this issue will be for someone to develop a replacement aftermarket chip.

 

[billkunert]

I was under the impression that the European Union had laws specifically forbidding printer manufacturers from doing anything that would eliminate the ability to refill or use refilled cartridges. If what you are saying about the 4300 is true it would seem to be in violation of the law in Europe.

 

[WhiteDog]

Without a clear warning on the retail package the practice is likely to be illegal in most states and Canadian provinces as well.

 

[websnail]

As far as I can tell the issue with the iP4300 started approx 1 month into production. The vary first printers that were produced will reset using the method outlined in the user manual. Approx 1 month into production of the printer the reset procedure was removed from the firmware, and the printer manual.

Ok..

It would appear that the easiest way to see if your printer will work would be to check your manual to see if it has the Ink Monitor Disable procedure. One of my resources has found all printers that have been released after the iP4300 to be missing the firmware that allows for the ink counters to be disabled. This source also produces a commercial Canon chip resetter that integrates into the printer ($700), and he noted that Canon included code in thier firmware that prevents his resetter from working with these models.

It would appear that the only way around this issue will be for someone to develop a replacement aftermarket chip.

AFAIK there's never been a reset procedure in any of my manuals so that's a non starter..

I do know however that all of the printers I have here, some of the very much post iP4300 are all working fine... so it could be a USA only thing... So far though nobody else has been able to confirm this issue at all and that makes me wonder if, with the greatest of respect, your source is referring to the ability for chips to be reset using the resetters that are now appearing rather than the "accept warranty resonsibility" 3 times and you're on your own "reset".

 

[pharmacist]

Websnail,

Your theory about the no-resettability of USA-only models can be true. The EU Commission once legislated that printer manufacturers ar forbidden to make it completely impossible for their cartridges to be refilled due to environmental concerns. So Canon can disable the ink level status monitor, but is not allowed to make printing impossible if the cartridge has been refilled. I can not judge about the US federal laws.

 

[Marine]

If you look in the troubleshooting section of the iP4200 manual, Canon outlines disabling the ink counters. All of the iP4300 manuals that we have checked do not include this section.

We had sold several CFS units for these printers, some to iP4200 CFS users, and have since had all but one of them returned due to this issue. Unfortunatly, our printer seems to be early production as it works fine so I cannot test this issue in house.

 

[websnail]

If you look in the troubleshooting section of the iP4200 manual, Canon outlines disabling the ink counters. All of the iP4300 manuals that we have checked do not include this section.

We had sold several CFS units for these printers, some to iP4200 CFS users, and have since had all but one of them returned due to this issue. Unfortunatly, our printer seems to be early production as it works fine so I cannot test this issue in house.

Ok... thanks Marine..

Wasn't meaning you were lying or delusional (no, really!) but it's better to know exactly what the basis is for the report rather than guess.. Given that all my research is UK based and not finding this in UK versions, perhaps people in the US are going to need to do some troubleshooting of this the hard way.

Would suck rather a lot of it does turn out that Canon are taking liberties with the nation boundaries and laws just to push their luck.


So, over to your North American types...

 

[Tin Ho]

I just downloaded from Canon web site the ip4300 user's manual. The troubleshooting section still has the text that describes how to disable ink level status by pressing resume for 5 seconds. It is not different from ip4200. Ip4500 user's manual also has the same paragraph describing the procedure to turn off ink level status. All these manuals are available from official Canon USA website. These should clarify that all these printers are refillable.

 

[Marine]

Hmm. That is very strange indeed. We need to locate several USA customers with iP4300s to test this.