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Printer Profiles 101 - The basics of using profiles for your printer

Discussion in 'Printing Photos and Photo Software' started by Nifty, Mar 19, 2005.

  1. Nov 21, 2008
    Frankly

    Frankly Newbie to Printing

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    Hello,

    I am using Canon MP 210. The quesition is about it's scanner. The site http://www.ddisoftware.com/prism/help/faq.htm says about scanners: " It often depends more on the scanning software than the scanner hardware itself. If you have access to good scanning software that allows you to acquire a raw scan with color management turned off, most likely your scanner will do the job. If all you have are the most basic controls offered by the "standard" Windows interface (brightness and contrast), you may not be able to operate your scanner in a mode that allows it to capture the entire color target. When set to default scan settings, most scanners will clip both the shadows and highlights as they try to create an image with too much contrast. This means that part of the color target is actually not captured. It is therefore often necessary to turn off scanner color management to obtain a "raw" scan. ".

    The question is how to turn it off in order to get "raw" scan.

    Which scanner hardware, software or software settings would you recommend me to get or do? Does the dpi matter?
     
  2. Nov 21, 2008
    on30trainman

    on30trainman Printer Guru

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    Frankly,
    I will try to give an answer to your question. I have Profile Prism and a Canon LiDE 60 scanner. When I was considering PP I e-mailed Mike Cheney (DDI Software) and asked about scanners. He replyed that the Canon LiDE series scanners were a good choice for a reasonably priced unit. I don't know if the scanner in the MP210 AIO is from the LiDE family or not. The LiDE comes with CanoScan scanning software - don't know what came with your MP210.

    Now about scanning for PP. The PP scanning instructions are for using VueScan. I looked into VueScan and found that it costs $80 for the version that supports RAW scans. Thought that was too much. But I found there was a way to use CanoScan. On Yahoo Groups there is a PP forum (called prismtalk) which is supported by Mike Cheney. In the files section there is a very good tutorial (.doc form) called "LiDE Scanner Tips & Settings" on using CanoScan to generate a 48 bit TIFF scan which works almost as good as a raw scan. I have used it many times and have gotten good profiles for my paper/ink combinations. It gives the settings needed in CanoScan to make the TIFF scan, what programs support 48 bit TIFF and how to use the scan in PP.
    Here is the link: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/prismtalk/files/LiDE Scanner Tips & Settings /
    Don't know if you have to be signed up for Yahoo Groups to be able to get to it.
    Again I don't know if your scanner supports CanoScan or not.

    Steve W.
     
  3. Jan 15, 2013
    cls

    cls Printer Guru

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  4. Jan 17, 2013
    PeterBJ

    PeterBJ Printer VIP Platinum Printer Member

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    Hi cls.

    Do you think that a scanner such as the HP Scanjet 4070 would be adequate? It is a good CCD scanner for home use, but not professional grade. And is it possible to use the profile obtained with a scanner and reference card with a Pixma 5200 without having to buy Adobe Photoshop or other expensive software?

    I have no experience with profiling, so excuse my newbie questions. I think one of the problems is that Canon printers do not use ICC profiles but ICM profiles, whatever that means?
     
  5. Jan 17, 2013
    Grandad35

    Grandad35 Printer Master Moderator

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    http://www.color.org/faqs.xalter#p9
     
  6. Jan 18, 2013
    barfl2

    barfl2 Print Addict

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    Thanks Grandad35 very useful link. Have saved it to my downloads to peruse at leisure
     
  7. May 29, 2014
    3dogs

    3dogs Printer Master

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    Am I understanding that part of the intent of this thread is to create a library of colour profiles for folks to download and use?
    If the answer is yes, then that just put wheels under my understanding of profiles and sent it into the oncoming traffic lane so to speak.
    Because :
    I use Canson papers, amongst others, so I download a Canson ICC profile, install it on my computer and away I go. Thus far what I have learned as a newbie profiler is that Cansons profiles created for use on an Epson 3880 on their high end equipment does not give me the results I expected. However, taking the same paper, making my own profile on my own machine gave me results that are closer to my expectations.
    Added:
    I created a profile for the Xerox iGen 3 which is white semi luster that I print as matte. I also used a Canson Montval ICC Profile to produce an image taken up in our Rainforest recently. The colour of the paper has a profound effect, as does subtle differences in the same Brand/ Type of paper. I used the ICC profile for Montval and printed on Montval Watercolour paper, which is not treated for inkjet printing.
    White paper gives a "cooler" look than the creamy Montval..........
    My assumption was/is that profiling results in say greens, being represented equally regardless of paper, this trial suggests otherwise, am I off track here too?

    Being a newbie may be the cause of my difficulties with the Canson made ICC profiles, well there is a very HIGH likeleyhood !
    I think it would be grand to have such a library within this forum.

    Cheers

    Andrew
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2014
  8. May 30, 2014
    mikling

    mikling Printer VIP Platinum Printer Member

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    Once you learn how to use custom ICC profiles, there is no going back. For most people, when custom profiles are used, the paper choice is now mainly based on texture and feel and "look" that you like. The question of different colors resulting from different papers is very very small.

    There are many barriers for new users to use custom ICC profiles.

    First is that more advanced software is typically required.Adobe Photoshop, Lightroom, Aperture, ACDSee, etc. and the two least expensive alternatives are Adbobe Photoshop Elements..a simplified version of Photoshop. Version 6 and newer supports color management. The other one is software called Qimage. If you don't own any of these packages, all is not lost. With the proper choice of printers, you are able to use ICC profiles WITHOUT these high end software. Most of the Epson 13" wide printers will allow this and more recently, the Canon Pro-100 and the 6 tank LETTER size printers that use the PGI-250/CLI-251 like the Canon MG6320 also allow this. If you are starting out, by acquiring these printers and not having to acquire more complicated software is a BIG advantage. Do not forget this.

    The second barrier is getting ICC profiles. Most ICC profiles cannot be legally shared amongst different users. The license limitations of the software to create this disallows it. So most people are unable to obtain custom ICC profiles and the only way is to make them yourself by either getting each one custom made or getting a package to do so. These packages will cost hundreds of dollars. So where is the economy right?

    The third barrier is that there are so many different papers and inks etc. and furthermore most ink sellers don't have the foggiest of what you'd be asking them about in an ICC profile. You're on your own bud.

    I have solved all the above problems for the refiller. Let me say I sure WISHED the files etc. were there when I first started out refilling. Well now they are. My profiles are FREE. Yes, FREE. They are fully LEGAL to share. They are created with some of the best hardware at the Pro Level and not consumer equipment using one of the best ICC packages available.

    The papers supported are both OEM and aftermarket papers with one of the most economical papers out there.
    I have not developed instructions yet. It has taken a LOT of work and over 6 months of solid work to create these profiles. That's one reason why ink sellers don't provide it. It costs a LOT in time and resources. The caveat is that the ink and paper specified must be used but that IS what an ICC profile is. If you don't take advantage of it,, then you're missing out really. To acquire a similar system of profiling will cost many many hours of learning, papers and over $1500 in hardware. and this is provided free.

    Profiles are provided for the popular printers that refillers purchase.

    So while a library cannot be posted on the site. Such a LEGAL library exists at my site. You can find them by searching for your model through the menu system.

    For example:
    http://www.precisioncolors.com/PC42ICC.html

    Do check out the EZ method of using ICC profiles. It is TOO easy.

    Others such as jtoolman has also taken the time to create videos on how to use profiles.

    Finally, one key element of using ICC profiles is to have your monitor calibrated. That will cost a fraction of what you'd need otherwise.

    Current recommended Canon printers for refillers is the Canon Pro-100 and Canon MG6320 and variants with 6 tank CLI-251 carts/551 in Europe.
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2014
    Tudor, The Hat, PeterBJ and 1 other person like this.
  9. May 30, 2014
    stratman

    stratman Printer VIP Platinum Printer Member

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    @mikling - Superb post! Thank you for all you do. :clap:thumbsup
     
  10. May 30, 2014
    3dogs

    3dogs Printer Master

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    Purchasing and using any of the available Calibration Tools just takes money, only prohibition I can find is selling for profit without permission and fees!

    So who exactly says, is willing to enforce, such a prohibition?

    I have created my own profiles for a number of papers using Cone inks for my 3880, CANON Pro 9000 and Artisan 730, what who is preventing me from posting my profile for use by others using same gear?

    Its not LEGAL to refill, its not LEGAL to reuse OEM catrs etc.

    You have my curiosity and full attention :pop:pop
     
    ice-t and The Hat like this.

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