HowTo: apples vs apples speed test for bulk photo printing?

[l_d_allan]

I've done some less than scientific speed timings for my two CLI-8 based printers, and getting ready to do some more. I've got a four day event coming up in late June that involves 300 to 1000+ letter size prints. So far, I have concerns that my printing workflow needs to get faster / more efficient, perhaps with use of additional printers.

I'd appreciate input from forum members who have done such timings on how to get more accurate results with reasonable cost-of-materials, miminize potential harm to the printer, and not take too much of my time for "baby-sitting".

I've read a number of reviews and specs of different Canon printers, but the blended timing tests they use don't really match my situation.

I am aware that nozzle count is a major factor in print speed, but I'm unclear just how much difference it makes. My understanding is that my iP4500 and Pro 9000-2 are both relatively fast inkjet printers.

 

[crexas]

Well IP4500 print speed is somewhat similar to IP4700 that I've been using for the last year and I've been told these printers are really fast for inkjets. I remember my friend buying an Epson all-in-one printer and printing a test A4 photo which took him more than 10 minutes on best quality, whereas my Canon took just about 4min. I mainly print A4 sized prints. I use ciss for my printing. A4 color prints on standard photo quality settings come out in about 2mins. I usually make about 120-170 prints in 8 hours. That time includes a few printhead cleans and flushes in my bathroom, ciss refill, occasional stops because the paper runs out and so on. Your prints are smaller (maybe 2x smaller?) which means you will do more prints in the same time, although you don't use ciss. But IP4500 has larger carts than my IP4700 so you won't sacrifice a lot more time refilling them. Why not fire up a stopwatch and make a test print? That's what I always do and later calculated predictions for large quantity printing don't come far from real experience unless you stumble upon some unexpected problems with your printer.

 

[ghwellsjr]

When I was doing my speed comparison test between two wide format printers, I was careful to use a fast computer. My old laptop is slow and can cause the printers to hesitate between scans of the print head. If you see that happening, it is probably not caused by the printer itself. Also, it takes time to get a print started so you want to get several prints in the queue and time how long one of the printouts takes after there is no hesitation.

 

[l_d_allan]

Crexas,
Thanks for the feedback.

I usually make about 120-170 prints in 8 hours.

I infer you do a lot of printing. You've got my full attention ... somebody who has 'been there, done that'. Any idea of how many A4 prints you make in an average month? Photos? Text? Mix?

So it works out to be about 15 to 22 per hour? Based on nozzle counts (4608 vs 4416), it does appear that our print speeds should be very similar. Your CLI-221 based printer has 9ml carts vs the significantly larger 13ml carts in my CLI-8 based printers.

That time includes a few printhead cleans and flushes in my bathroom.

Not meaning to hijack my own thread, but that surprises me. I've had less than stellar nozzle checks if I haven't printed for a few days, but usually a basic Clean cycle from the print-driver clears things up and I'm "good to go" for as long as I'm actively printing that day.

Once I start a printing project with several good nozzle checks and good hammer tests accomplished, I don't recall ever having a flawed nozzle check midway into printing. I do make it a practice to look for evidence of banding every 10 prints or so, which would indicate problems.

My experience with print-heads during the time-frame of one day is that "once it starts working, it keeps working." Obviously, there are delays for paper reloading and replacing Low/Empty carts. And who knows what tomorrow may bring ... sigh.

So am I reading correctly that every 50 to 100 prints, it is typical that you take the print-head out of the printer, and rinse it out? What is the evidence that tells you this is necessary? Does that rinsing usually suffice to get the printer back to working ok? I'm ignorant about CISS, but it kind of sounds like ink flow problems.

Your prints are smaller (maybe 2x smaller?) which means you will do more prints in the same time,

Not really ... my understanding is that A4 and 8.5x11" letter size are equivalent . Both of our printers would be described as "A4 printers" in that the largest size they can do is A4. In the USA, that is 8.5x11" a.k.a. letter size.

Why not fire up a stopwatch and make a test print?

I've actually done that several times, but I don't have all that much confidence in my results because I was admittedly casual about how I went about it. I also haven't factored in work-flow delays such as paper loading and cart replacement.

TMI: The camp director is not all that pleased at my smiling "I hope so" when he asks if the 20+ groups of 3 to 40+ kiddos can be done by noon Thursday when they depart camp. I can't blame him. We'll take pictures of the "critical path" largest groups Monday evening, so we have about 60 hours elapsed wall clock time until Thursday noon.

That works out to a top priority of ~300 for that part of the camp printing. Lower priority will be an overall print of all 300 kiddos together. Individual prints of kiddos having fun will probably be done in the subsequent weeks, but maybe some on Thursday if there is time and all goes well.

From last year:

 

[l_d_allan]

When I was doing my speed comparison test between two wide format printers

Thanks ... interesting that the thread immediately went OT and never returned from being hijacked. If it would be of interest, I recall doing some A3+ timings with the 9000-2, and can provide them as an update to your 2007 thread. Obviously, we would be printing different files, so it would be "apples and oranges"

Do you still happen to have the file you used? I could make the same print with different settings while timing. However, A3+ paper is much more expensive per sq in than commodity A4.

I was careful to use a fast computer.

Again thanks. That's also been my observation. I would have thought that once the data is pumped through the USB cable, the computer wouldn't be all that involved. That doesn't seem to be the case at all. Makes sense as I believe the print-driver has to figure out what every value of not just every pixel, but every dot needs to be. 300 ppi becomes 2400-4800 dpi?

So I infer that a stand-alone printer like the MX850 which can print independently of a computer must have the print-driver logic and CPU capability to do what the desktop or laptop is doing for printers like the iP4500 and 9000-2. Correct?

The other day, I did just a little testing of a laptop driving both printers with two USB cables. My timings were admittedly casual, but it did seem like both printers slowed down by a 10% to 30% factor. My casual timings indicate that the iP4500 and 9000-2 are both about the same speed, but two working at the same time weren't twice as fast as one by itself.

Also, it takes time to get a print started so you want to get several prints in the queue and time how long one of the printouts takes after there is no hesitation.

Mostly agree, except for "bulk printing", I don't want to ignore the factor of maintenance cycles initiated by what Canon describes as "dot count cleaning" based on some count threshold.

Here are some of my thoughts, and feedback appreciated to "correct the error of my ways" or issues I am ignorant about:

* Timing of one print is meaningless to me ... too many maintenance issues so variability is too high

* Seems like doing 5 would smooth this out quite a bit. 10 would be better, but maybe excessive?

* Use one or several defined Kodak-like test prints for repeatability?

* Want to make sure nozzle check is unflawed prior to timings to avoid print-head damage.

* Use of 4 x 6 paper size might carry reduced risk of ink flow problems which could be harmful to print-heads? But commodity letter size paper is less expensive per square inch. Maybe use a paper cutter to turn plain 8.5x11" into a pair of tall 4.25x11"?

* Might want to start timing when the printer has actually started printing, to eliminate factor of some runs having preliminary cleaning cycle and some not?

* Or force a cleaning cycle by turning the printer off and back on so it would be more predictable? Or raise the cover and take out all carts to force a known cleaning cycle?

* I think you'd want to do enough printing to force one or several "dot count cleaning" maintenance cycles. It would throw off timings if some runs had zero "dot count cleaning" cycles, some runs had one cycle, and some runs had two.

* To hold costs down, use plain paper rather than photo paper and "fool" the print-driver to think photo paper being used? If so, what would be the appropriate MediaType to use?

* Other factors?

 

[guyg]

I kind of feel you may be overthinking this If you have oem carts with quality inks I would ride it hard and put it away wet. People push these printers with cis systems all day, every day for months on end, until they drop. A few hundred prints over several days should be no problem at all.

 

[l_d_allan]

I kind of feel you may be overthinking this If you have oem carts with quality inks I would ride it hard and put it away wet. People push these printers with cis systems all day, every day for months on end, until they drop. A few hundred prints over several days should be no problem at all.

Mostly agree ... I'm not that concerned about wearing out the printer. It's more an issue of whether there are enough hours to get the prints made. I'm used to laser-jet speeds, and still haven't really adjusted to just how much slower the inkjets are.

On a budget 1320 HP laserjet that is 8+ years old, 300 copies (of text) might take 10 minutes?

 

[Redbrickman]

Apples and Pears springs to mind here, as you can't compare the speed of an inkjet producing high quaity photo prints with with a laser turning out text :/

If time is crucial just have someone bring/buy another printer, hint - the camp director maybe

Problem sorted, no disappointed kids



Oh BTW just to split hairs here, A4 and Letter are not the same physical size, one is longer and thinner then the other...

A4 - 8.3 X 11.7 Inches

US Letter - 8.5 X 11 Inches

 

[guyg]

There are very fast inkjets, they just are not for consumers.

The day before ON DEMAND 2011 opened, Canon invited printing industry analysts to see its new DreamLabo 5000, which is targeted toward the production photo printing market. Using a 12-inch printhead and seven dye-based aqueous ink colors (CMYK plus light cyan, light magenta, and gray) the devices key selling point is its quality level, which Canon says compares very favorably to silver halide reproduction methods. Indeed, the samples that Canon handed out were very impressive. The DreamLabo 5000 is capable of producing a 20-page A4-format photo album in 72 seconds or forty 4x 6 photo prints in a minute. These speeds are much faster than silver halide processes, yet the quality is comparable. Ink and paper can be changed on the fly.

Now that would get your camp photos done

I guess you can hope for 60 8x10's an hour with 2 printers ?

 

[crexas]

So it works out to be about 15 to 22 per hour?

It's really more like 25-30 per hour but at the end of the day the average is lower because of the whole lunch/printhead clean/paper load/ciss refill downtime.

you take the print-head out of the printer, and rinse it out? What is the evidence that tells you this is necessary? Does that rinsing usually suffice to get the printer back to working ok? I'm ignorant about CISS, but it kind of sounds like ink flow problems.

I really don't know what's the deal with my printhead but after ~80-100 prints magenta or yellow suddenly disappears completely. Can't see any flow problems, no air bubbles in ciss. Rinsing printhead under hot water does the trick every time and after that nozzle checks are perfect again. Well.... actually it's not "rinsing" that I do. I have a huge syringe that fits perfectly on top of the printhead ink inlets, so I fill my syringe with hot water and then push that water through my printhead until I see a perfect water fountain coming out from nozzles I don't use distilled water. Most would say it's dangerous, but works for me every time. 5 days a week. 20 days in a month. For two months and then printhead is gone. Could be my ink, since it used to happen to all previous ip4700 printers but I'm not too concerned about it. Cleaning printhead takes no more than 5 minutes and it helps to clean the dried ink from the sides of printhead that gets there during printer self-cleaning cycles.

Not really ... my understanding is that A4 and 8.5x11" letter size are equivalent . Both of our printers would be described as "A4 printers" in that the largest size they can do is A4. In the USA, that is 8.5x11" a.k.a. letter size.

I imagined a simple letter like we use in our office ^^

Any idea of how many A4 prints you make in an average month? Photos? Text? Mix?

I don't print text. I print only graphics (something similar to photos) on the whole A4 sheet. I "CAN" make 120-170 prints a day with my printer, but I don't print that much each day for a month. Usually no less than 50 but the average in a month is about 2000-3000 prints. And I buy a new printer every 2 months

At the moment I use 2x Canon IP4700's and if I can remember correctly I have made a maximum of 400 prints in one day with both of them combined (printing on matte paper/standard quality settings). It took a little more than 8 hours. But I believe that since you are in a hurry, you will have to spend more time as well.