Epson 3880 - Will be the death of me!!

TexAndie

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Greetings To All!

I'm sorry that my very first post will be LONG - I believe it is better to explain everything I HAVE tried, and that saves a lot of suggestions about trying something that I already have. ;-)

This past week, I ran into an issue that NO ONE IN THE WORLD seems to have encountered, nor resolved. I found ONE post about the same issue from 2012, it was a person who prints photos, and no one had any ideas for HIM, so he just gave up and bought a different printer. I have two Epson Stylus Pro 3880s. I call them printer A and printer B. I have only recently begun DTF printing. No worries, I am not going to throw any DTF questions at you - I have plenty of help for THAT. Because I'm not yet printing all day, every day, I, at the very least, make certain that I run a full color 13x19 print on each printer daily, and manually clean the heads and use capping solution on the capping station before shutting them down each day. When I first rec'd the printers, there were a few choppy prints, broken lines on nozzle checks that weren't cleared by running cleaning cycles, so I replaced the dampers and completely flushed the lines, the manifold and the print head clear on BOTH printers before starting up again. That was about 3 mos ago.


For those not familiar, with DTF, we only print CMYK+ White. Because one can only see the "white" ink when printing an actual print on film for transfer, I did not realize that printer A had stopped laying down white ink until I went to print a transfer last week on it, because printer B was having "head strike" issues. (That RUINS a DTF print and wastes a LOT of pricey ink and film!) I checked the manifold and could see that there was no white at all. I tested my dampers for clogs and there weren’t any. I cleared the manifold and the p-head again and put it all back together. Ran an cart initialization via the adjwiz and attempted another test print. The first time I tried a nozzle check, the printer ran thru the entire process purring like a kitten, error free, but the page was blank. I tried a 2nd time and within about 30 seconds, the printer stopped, and I received error 131B, which indicates the p-head is overheating. I found ONE video online that tells me this is EITHER a clog (either in the head, or the dampers) or a bad p-head. Since I had already ensured both were clear, I decided to test the p-head on printer B (ONLY the head). I rec'd the same error, so I stopped testing with THAT p-head. I put the printer B's p-head back in place. and ran a quick cleaning cycle. Now, I run a nozzle check on printer B and it goes thru all the motions, makes all the right sounds but EVERY page comes out blank!! Ink is making it thru the entire system as I can see all colors in the manifold as well as in the waste tank. So, HERE, is where I am stuck. I have had ppl tell me to check the main board for a blown "ink selector fuse". Well, the ONLY reference I can find in the entire service manual to anything related to an "ink selector" is selecting between MB and PB, and I have no issues with that. Even if I did, we don't print with Matte Black at all, so as long as your chip reads, it really doesn't matter because both carts share a common line. I have never used a multi-meter, but I ordered one and took printer A apart and removed the main board for testing. I have NO idea what to test or what I should see when I DO test - but I tried my best to learn from a few brief tutorials and can only say that every circuit, chip, resistor or fuse on the board tests as "good". (I can't even find anyone who can tell me WHAT on the main board to test!!)

Due to my electronic ignorance, I set printer A aside and decided to focus on printer B - figuring worst case, printer A can become a "parts" printer. For anyone who is in the industry, these old Epson's are workhorse and are some of the highly sought after (and highly priced) printers because other than printers that can run chipless, or the ETs, Epson has fixed all the other good ones (SC-700 & SC-900) so that no one can reset chips or use third part anything. EcoTanks, while great, are not used in DTF because the inks must be shaken daily or the settle and thicken and can ruin the p-head.

I have taken as many variables out of the loop as I can. New main. tank, OEM cart chips/carts that are full. I does not matter what I do, or what I try or how I attempt to print, it's the same result. I've tried to run a nozzle check from the control pain on the printer, from Windows, and from my RIP software. It makes no difference. EVERY print attempt I make, the printer goes thru all the motions make all the right noises, p-head swiftly goes back and forth....and the page rolls out BLANK.

Of course, the idea of bad p-heads runs thru my mind non-stop, but on BOTH printers, within an hour of each other?? And to even find a new print head, they don't make them, so I take a chance at dropping between $500 - $1000 on an Aliexpress special, or spend just about the same amount and hope that whomever I buy one from doesn't sell me a dud.

Thus far, all I've done is SPEND a LOT of money, a little at a time - probably upwards of 10K. I have put so much money toward working with the 3880s (cartridges, chips, M-tanks, etc, etc) that the thought of trying another printer gives me a panic attack. To simply buy another of these 3880s, as to not make all my investments pointless, would run upwards of $3K. As I said, because everybody in DTF wants one, the price is OVER THE TOP.

If there is any one out there, anywhere, who can offer some words of wisdom, I cannot even express how much that would mean to me. I am completely out of ideas.

To whomever might read this, thank you for your patience. I'm crossing my fingers that someone has an idea.

Thanks,
Andria
 

Ink stained Fingers

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I'm not familiar with DTF printing, but reading through various postings I'm coming to the conclusion that you very much are describing the main issue with DTF inks and necessary maintenance
because the inks must be shaken daily or the settle and thicken and can ruin the p-head.

Do you really need the A2 format of the 3880 printer ? - I just see that other printers - for A3 - like the L1800 Ecotank are used for DTF printing

https://www.inkexperts.co.uk/produc...ilm-dtf/dtf-conversion-kit/ecotank-l1800-kit/

I don't know if that's a realiable approach - but at least the access to the printhead is easiser and a printhead would be cheaper than for the 3880 .

I only can advise you to use a printer for which you can get local support by a company which could service your printer(s) in case you cannot fix the problem. You spent alrready that much for the 3880's and I don't see that you are getting anywhere.

When I look to Youtube I see various clips showing maintenance actions on the printhead - of a L1800 - an Ecotank printer which seems to be quite popular for DTF printing



Do you really need A2 printing of the 3880 ? Sorry - I'm out at this point since I'm not familiar with DTF printing in detail.
 

The Hat

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To whomever might read this, thank you for your patience. I'm crossing my fingers that someone has an idea.
From what I can ascertain from your post, you reported an issue with the print head on printer A, that gave an 131B error and no matter what you did the pages all came out blank after that..

Then you decided to test printer B’s print head in printer A and it then gave the same error, then your reinstalled printer B’s print head back into printer B and it too printed blanks after that, so have I got it right up to now.. !

If this is the case then what you have done is… the print head in printer A got some electrical damaged which in turn also damaged the logic board, then by putting printer B’s print head into printer A, that head then got damaged by the logic board in printer A.

But when you reinstalled the now damaged test print head back into printer B, it then damaged the logic board in printer B too, so now you’re going to need new logic boards and print heads for both printers, that’s if I am getting the story correct up till now.. Sorry because it’s a bit hard to follow.... I do hope I've got it wrong..
 

websnail

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If this is the case then what you have done is…
I'm inclined to go with @The Hat on this one but it'd be a WAG (Wild Asses Guess) so don't put too much stock on that opinion.

As to the original White ink issue I'd put money on the fact that it's white ink being a congealed horrible mess to work with. I'm basing that on various conversations I've had with Dye-sub sufferers ... I mean "users" where White ink has been the main contributing factor for contributions to the proverbial swear/cuss jar.

Likewise I'll be crossing my fingers...
 

mikling

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Even when running the old and hardy R2100/2200 converted to DTF printers , replacinng printheads was routine for service people from the DTF industry. Seeing what I saw when visiting DTF printer service centers I would never go near that myself, you need to keep that machine running all the time as much as possible and also understand that white ink is bad stuff that wears out printheads and they are treated as consumables in that industry,
The total blank suggests an electrical problem. With a printer that old, it could be just one connection to power. Bad or corroded contacts is common. Most qualified places will just replace the mainboard with a new one and new cables ( they call this the technician bomb. Just keep throwing new parts until it is fixed( Common in the auto industry today))
Diagnosing will take a lot of time unless you are lucky. Techinicians will replace as that is the most straightforward thing to do to ensure a repair within a certain time period. They do not have the tools nor training to replace components on a board. Even at a factory today, unless it is a known problematic component, assembled boards are simply junked. Reworking is a lot of work and expense unless there is software to check for key points. You might have a penny component causing a problem in an area where a $5 chip might be located. Rework? Not necessarily so. In China valued junk from these kinds of problems are diagnosed or disassembled to retrieve components that find their way into the repair market in Shenzen China. The people there can make slim profits at low wages to retrieve parts that are known to break, Same story with all electronics especially SMD type today. Boards now are mainly assembled by machines that consume little labor and the labor to disassemble and diagnose is simply too much unless you have a low cost channel for manual work.
 

TexAndie

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Thank you so much for taking the time to reply! Yes, I have been TRYING to check electronics, but really don't know about using a multi-meter. (TIME is of the essence as every day that passes, my $59/ltr ink is aging.) I've checked cables, and have had to "strip" the end of a flex cable because plugging and unplugging it frequently while working on it just wore it down. On one printer, the flex cables are pristine. Yes, I know about making sure the printer is printing regularly - CONSTANTLY right now, isn't really an option. I'm too new to the business and I would just be wasting ink and film to print all day, every day, especially since I have struggled with getting the prints right for transfer (I'm always learning!). I know MANY ppl in the industry who use this model and the 3800 for the very reason that it is such a workhorse and seems to run forever. One gal I know has run them for YEARS. BUT, no one has encountered the problem I am having. It wouldn't be so unbelievable if not for the fact that BOTH printers started having this issue the same day. THAT baffles me more than anything. The printer that has not been dismantled has had less exposure to the DTF ink than the one I took apart. I just REALLY thought with an electrical problem, I would see an error message. From my understanding, 98% of the printers sold FOR DTF, are essentially the various Epson models that have been renewed and put into prettier packaging. I suppose my #1 mission at this point is to TRY and prevent having to figure out how to find an affordable WORKING p-head that would cost 1/2 of the price of replacing these printers. I have to consider money spent to use these printers (chips, refillable carts, resetters, etc, etc) vs the price of using a different model of printer all together and starting over again. You've given me a lot to think about and I truly, truly do appreciate it!
 

TexAndie

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From what I can ascertain from your post, you reported an issue with the print head on printer A, that gave an 131B error and no matter what you did the pages all came out blank after that..

Then you decided to test printer B’s print head in printer A and it then gave the same error, then your reinstalled printer B’s print head back into printer B and it too printed blanks after that, so have I got it right up to now.. !

If this is the case then what you have done is… the print head in printer A got some electrical damaged which in turn also damaged the logic board, then by putting printer B’s print head into printer A, that head then got damaged by the logic board in printer A.

But when you reinstalled the now damaged test print head back into printer B, it then damaged the logic board in printer B too, so now you’re going to need new logic boards and print heads for both printers, that’s if I am getting the story correct up till now.. Sorry because it’s a bit hard to follow.... I do hope I've got it wrong..
You did understand correctly, with just ONE variance: printer A gave me the blank pages right AFTER I had manually cleaned the dampers/lines and even removed and cleaned the cartridge holder I did the cleaning at first because I didn't realize that printer A had stopped laying white ink. When I put it back together, reinitialized the carts via the adjwiz that is when I got the error 131B. The ONE video that I found on YouTube about that error message the guy stated it was due to a clogged damper, he cleared his dampers, and everything went on as normal. THAT is why I tested that p-head on B - I knew for a fact in advance that all lines in printer A were clear, I had JUST cleared them. It just never occurred to me that testing the same p-head on printer B would harm anything - but it does make sense. It literally threw up the error and stopped itself withing 30 secs. Might just be time for a parting out sale. The only good news is that I got both of these printers for a steal and the parts go for a nice profit in DTF market. Thanks again for your time!
 

TexAndie

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I'm inclined to go with @The Hat on this one but it'd be a WAG (Wild Asses Guess) so don't put too much stock on that opinion.

As to the original White ink issue I'd put money on the fact that it's white ink being a congealed horrible mess to work with. I'm basing that on various conversations I've had with Dye-sub sufferers ... I mean "users" where White ink has been the main contributing factor for contributions to the proverbial swear/cuss jar.

Likewise I'll be crossing my fingers...
You are VERY correct about the white ink, hence the reason high-quality proven inks are a MUST have. The gals who runs the FB group where I have learned so much tests and gives very honest opinions on everything in the market - to the degree that DTGPro shipped her a $10,000 Thunderbird FREE so that she could work it to death and give them honest feedback about the printer. In our group, there are 3.5K members and every person who uses DTGPro's ink, swears by it. Not knowing any better (and not being a member of the group at that time) I ordered some cheap ink from an unknown, spent a lot of money, and the ink clogged my p-head HORRIBLY. Not so much my p-head, as the manifold that sits on top. It has tiny, tiny input holes and the clogs that can occur are MIND-BOGGLING, I mean, even PiezoFlush could not clear them. I spent many, many days with a syringe working thru the clogs. (YES, I DID separate the p-head from the manifold first!!! There is nothing electronic in/on the manifold once the p-head is removed!) Y'all are going to shudder, but ultimately, the only way I was able to get ONE of the clogs out was the put WD40 into the the syringe and drip it in and let it sit. AGAIN, nothing harsh came NEAR the actual p-head, I PROMISE, cause I'm sure everyone is thinking I shorted the p-head this way, but I did not. This was actually about 4 months ago, and until last week, it was running fine. :)
 

TexAndie

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I'm not familiar with DTF printing, but reading through various postings I'm coming to the conclusion that you very much are describing the main issue with DTF inks and necessary maintenance


Do you really need the A2 format of the 3880 printer ? - I just see that other printers - for A3 - like the L1800 Ecotank are used for DTF printing

https://www.inkexperts.co.uk/produc...ilm-dtf/dtf-conversion-kit/ecotank-l1800-kit/

I don't know if that's a realiable approach - but at least the access to the printhead is easiser and a printhead would be cheaper than for the 3880 .

I only can advise you to use a printer for which you can get local support by a company which could service your printer(s) in case you cannot fix the problem. You spent alrready that much for the 3880's and I don't see that you are getting anywhere.

When I look to Youtube I see various clips showing maintenance actions on the printhead - of a L1800 - an Ecotank printer which seems to be quite popular for DTF printing



Do you really need A2 printing of the 3880 ? Sorry - I'm out at this point since I'm not familiar with DTF printing in detail.
I'm sorry, I did not address your question about the A2. I wanted wide format, as we can print large transfers are well as many small pieces, but that really isn't why I went with this printer. The guy who sold them to me made me one hell of a deal and everyone in my group who uses them, swears by them. I tried the XP-15000 initially. It was brand new and me at that time having no idea what the hell I was doing, watched a video, where it was suggested to keep running cleaning cycles until you get print (I had set up a CISS for it and it wasn't printing) I managed to short out the main board on a $600 investment a week after taking it out of the box. So, the first thing I learned when starting out with the 3880s is get rid of the pretty packaging. We run them naked then all of the components are VERY easy to access. I have the print head disassembly/reassembly down to about 10 minutes. Less is more in DTF! Y'all can just SEE the money spewing out of my life.....lol
 

TexAndie

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I'm not familiar with DTF printing, but reading through various postings I'm coming to the conclusion that you very much are describing the main issue with DTF inks and necessary maintenance


Do you really need the A2 format of the 3880 printer ? - I just see that other printers - for A3 - like the L1800 Ecotank are used for DTF printing

https://www.inkexperts.co.uk/produc...ilm-dtf/dtf-conversion-kit/ecotank-l1800-kit/

I don't know if that's a realiable approach - but at least the access to the printhead is easiser and a printhead would be cheaper than for the 3880 .

I only can advise you to use a printer for which you can get local support by a company which could service your printer(s) in case you cannot fix the problem. You spent alrready that much for the 3880's and I don't see that you are getting anywhere.

When I look to Youtube I see various clips showing maintenance actions on the printhead - of a L1800 - an Ecotank printer which seems to be quite popular for DTF printing



Do you really need A2 printing of the 3880 ? Sorry - I'm out at this point since I'm not familiar with DTF printing in detail.
Oh, and BTW, do NOT waste any of your time watching or God-Forbid buying ANYTHING from KingdomDTF!! I won't get into why...just don't.
 
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