Calibrating and Profiling Monitors...do it correctly. Use Argyll CMS.

[3dogs]

I have read that LED TV' may be more accurately calibrated after ~100 hours of use.

I have also read varying amounts of time for a monitor to be turned on before calibrating, from 15 -60 minutes. The following is a paper on how long after turning on a monitor before calibrating:

http://www.spectracal.com/downloads/files/Website/Website Articles/Display Warm Up Rates - How Long is Enough.pdf

It is handy to have this information, and the warm up time looks to be far longer than EIZO suggest. Seems I got lucky because I always got bored waiting for the warm up time to pass and got on here, or spent time wading through 'stuff' on the net, although I have not kept track of just how long these diversions go on, I will now ensure that it is no SHORTER than an hour.

My calibration is done at around the time I normally get to process images, that is about 7 pm.. in winter its dark then but in summer it is light still so the inbuilt adjustment for ambient is handy. My Munki software is set up to remind me to recalibrate monthly.

Very handy information many thanks for posting

Added

@Emulator posted :-

One thing the exercise has shown is that the latest £200-£300 monitors can produce reasonable results if you are looking at sRGB. AdobeRGB is another matter, but when you look at the printers' performance, they still leave something to be desired.

The fact that my printer restricts the colours I can reproduce is the proverbial 'fly in the ointment' I have been tempted, often, to set the camera on sRGB, calibrate, profile and then print in sRGB. It really does my head in some days tweaking, tuning, adjusting the largest colour space possible............then sending it to the printer to get WHAT??

 

[Emulator]

It seems the 9000 II is a bit weak on the greens, but otherwise with the right Argyll profile it's not too bad. The 7D II has a HDR facility built in, I haven't got the hang of it yet, but it takes and merges 3 images, so that should provide a talking point. I am waiting for ROY to offer some test pics.!

Incidentally the DispcalGUI images in post#9 show a sidebar which when operated, provides masses of additional data about everything associated with the exercise. If you have ArgyllCMS installed on your machine, installing DispcalGUI is a straight forward download and install. Well worth exploring for the curious.

 

[The Hat]

The fact that my printer restricts the colours I can reproduce is the proverbial 'fly in the ointment' I have been tempted, often, to set the camera on sRGB, calibrate, profile and then print in sRGB. It really does my head in some days tweaking, tuning, adjusting the largest colour space possible............then sending it to the printer to get WHAT??

That is a real point of interest @3dogs, what can our printers reproduce ?

I hear guys say all to often that their prints come out way to dark, and ask why ?, I not being a professional just shrug and say to myself, “you altered your flaming prints that why”.

Then I hear guys say they shoot in Raw, another shrug from himself, because once you open your raw file in an App. it instantly compiles it so you can view it on your calibrated screen. (Raw prawns come to mind)

Now I can hear howls of, “no it flaming doesn’t you twit” and I can instantly say “O’ YES IT DOES “and you can keep saying the opposite, and we could be there forever. (Our very own Pantomime)

The next thing is this “16 bit thing” I mean what’s the point you simply can’t print in 16 bit anyway, your so called raw file is sent to your printer in RGB and it then converts it to CYMK on paper, so that should leave most totally bewildered, but are they ?

My point to all of this is there is awful lot of rainbow chasers (Experts) who talk the talk and say I can perform miracles with my great equipment much better than you can, so upgrade to my standards or get off the pot !

Finally:- You can have the best equipment in the world but if you lack the patients and skills to use it properly then you’ll be off chasing that far off rainbow again, but hell ask the guy (Expert) down the road and I’m sure he’ll tell you which way it went.. !

That's my rant finished for now and Roy’s shrink may have a whacky new client to deal with, Hm... what his number again please..

 

[stratman]

I played guitar in a previous life and had a nice assortment of higher end Fenders and Gibsons. One day I was at the local guitar shop loitering. A father and son were shopping for the young boy's first electric guitar. The store's employee plugged in a low end Fender Squire electric guitar and made amazing music with it. Better than me and my high priced axes. The child's eyes light up and the father had a look of satisfaction all for one low price.

Generally, it's the player, not the instrument, that makes beautiful music. A good instrument facilitates talent's results but will only give a nudge up, if at all, for the mediocre.

That said, I'd gladly compute away in my mediocrity with a $1000+ monitor!

 

[mikling]

This thread that I started was not to debate the superiority of the more expensive graphic monitor because they are disputably superior as I use a better one than the cheap and cheerful category that I also own. However it pointed out that many devices are actually underperforming regardless of cost. Also the facility to extract the most of equipment is there for free and only the cost of time. As a consequence, there can sometimes be equipment that performs beyond what the mfrs states for reasons of perhaps sharing parts with upper tier models etc. And finally, that proper setup with good software will yield tangible benefits regardless of equipment level and the performance improvement can be shocking at times.

So let's see some more people take the step and give Argyll a shot and see what comes out.

So far it looks like 2 for 2 on improvements.

 

[Emulator]

Having read a bit more of the DispcalGUI paperwork, I found that "warm up drift" can be compensated by ticking the appropriate boxes:-

Drift compensation during measurements (only available if using Argyll CMS >= 1.3.0)

White level drift compensation tries to counter luminance changes of a warming up display device. For this purpose, a white test patch is measured periodically, which increases the overall time needed for measurements.


Black level drift compensation tries to counter measurement deviations caused by black calibration drift of a warming up measurement device. For this purpose, a black test patch is measured periodically, which increases the overall time needed for measurements. Many colorimeters are temperature stabilised, in which case black level drift compensation should not be needed, but spectrometers like the i1 Pro or ColorMunki Design/Photo are not temperature compensated.

But you might just as well leave it on all day, before you profile, just like you always do!

 

[3dogs]

That is a real point of interest @3dogs, what can our printers reproduce ?

I hear guys say all to often that their prints come out way to dark, and ask why ?, I not being a professional just shrug and say to myself, “you altered your flaming prints that why”.

Then I hear guys say they shoot in Raw, another shrug from himself, because once you open your raw file in an App. it instantly compiles it so you can view it on your calibrated screen. (Raw prawns come to mind)

Now I can hear howls of, “no it flaming doesn’t you twit” and I can instantly say “O’ YES IT DOES “and you can keep saying the opposite, and we could be there forever. (Our very own Pantomime)

The next thing is this “16 bit thing” I mean what’s the point you simply can’t print in 16 bit anyway, your so called raw file is sent to your printer in RGB and it then converts it to CYMK on paper, so that should leave most totally bewildered, but are they ?

My point to all of this is there is awful lot of rainbow chasers (Experts) who talk the talk and say I can perform miracles with my great equipment much better than you can, so upgrade to my standards or get off the pot !

Finally:- You can have the best equipment in the world but if you lack the patients and skills to use it properly then you’ll be off chasing that far off rainbow again, but hell ask the guy (Expert) down the road and I’m sure he’ll tell you which way it went.. !

That's my rant finished for now and Roy’s shrink may have a whacky new client to deal with, Hm... what his number again please..

A GOOD rant has at its core genuine issues, that repeatedly get glossed over in the pastime I call MARKETING NOISE .

Before I bought a printer, i bought the V7 screen, for me that was a BS filter, to test what I was reading. I went from that to the EIZO simply because it has the ability to represent 98% of the colours I can get out of my camera.
Printing is like another passtime altogether for me. Whilst I sometimes get frustrated by the limitations and anomalies inherant in printing, I am first and foremost a digital image person.
I only really got into printing here, and then it is (to me) an off shoot of Digital Imaging,. but has a different set of rules I will TRY to explain..

Imagine a standard song we would all know and recognise, now give the score to a jazz muzo, and a jazz singer, what comes out is to me very much like a PRINTED image in Photography.

I have not been in the printing game long enough to be certain this is a valid view, but it IS how I explain the outcome in my own head......

BTW did Roy send you R.U. Nuts phone number he did not send it to me yet and I am starting to get an anxiety attack

 

[3dogs]

This thread that I started was not to debate the superiority of the more expensive graphic monitor because they are disputably superior as I use a better one than the cheap and cheerful category that I also own. However it pointed out that many devices are actually underperforming regardless of cost. Also the facility to extract the most of equipment is there for free and only the cost of time. As a consequence, there can sometimes be equipment that performs beyond what the mfrs states for reasons of perhaps sharing parts with upper tier models etc. And finally, that proper setup with good software will yield tangible benefits regardless of equipment level and the performance improvement can be shocking at times.

So let's see some more people take the step and give Argyll a shot and see what comes out.

So far it looks like 2 for 2 on improvements.

Geez Mike, you are snappier than an Australian sheepdog keeping us on track, and on song, for me one look at Argyll was enough to convince me that regardless of the benefits I have more than ample steep learning curves on my plate at this time.
It bothers me to hear you say that there are SIGNIFICANT benefits to be obtained with Argyll, doesn't say much for Munki. Is that true of all models and makes of commercial calibration equipment?

 

[3dogs]

I played guitar in a previous life and had a nice assortment of higher end Fenders and Gibsons. One day I was at the local guitar shop loitering. A father and son were shopping for the young boy's first electric guitar. The store's employee plugged in a low end Fender Squire electric guitar and made amazing music with it. Better than me and my high priced axes. The child's eyes light up and the father had a look of satisfaction all for one low price.

Generally, it's the player, not the instrument, that makes beautiful music. A good instrument facilitates talent's results but will only give a nudge up, if at all, for the mediocre.

That said, I'd gladly compute away in my mediocrity with a $1000+ monitor!

@stratman Your point is valid, so is the observation, that one needs to be careful to actually get what one pays for.
I excelled at fishing, custom rod building and training horses. I was always relaxed with passing on 100% of what I had learned, and explaining it so nothing remained hidden or obscured because - at the end of the day each person is only ever going to be as good as they can be when set on the right path. Then if that person can be better than me, so be it, but I have the win too, I had a hand in getting them there, and THAT opportunity is a gift, a very rare gift.
Good fishing gear made it easier to get good with less effort
Good practice made crafting thread work less effort
Good horse made learning to ride and train less effort
See no reason why the same would not apply to most things
Sure a good workman can make anything look easy, but the right tool for the job makes getting to be a good workman a heck of a lot easier and enjoyable.

 

[Emulator]

3dogs said: I went from that to the EIZO simply because it has the ability to represent 98% of the colours I can get out of my camera.

How do you know what you are getting from your camera?