Reset cli-8 not showing empty !

[martop]

Need a little help with this one, I refilled and reset all my cli-8 carts as wellas the PGBK5, I used the ink that came with the redsetter from RNB Import & Export ( patronenhandel.de ) I filled each cart using the german method with 22 guage needles, filling each one right up to remove any air, stuck them in the printer and its worked fine ever since. I have been doing a fair bit of printing over the last two days, mostly photo's and test pages to try and calibrate the printer / monitor.

The canon ink monitor shows all the carts as full but I decided to take a look to see how much ink I have used, the 5 black and cli-8 black, yellow and cyan are just under full but the magenta was under half full, I would have expected the ink monitor to show at least some usage but it shows it as full.

I am not sure how accurate this monitor is but am sure it used to show some usage in increments of I think was 1/8th then 1/4 then a half then empty.

I am wondering how this ink level sensor works, I know it uses a prism of some sort, would it be possible to damage this prism using the german refill method or could it be damaged while I washed the carts out ?

I took out the false reading cart and drew the rest of the ink off, replaced the cart and the printer still says its full !! I have since refilled it to full to make sure I dont burn the print head. I think, i know for sure it was saying empty befor I reset it.

martop

 

[headphonesman]

I am wondering how this ink level sensor works, I know it uses a prism of some sort, would it be possible to damage this prism using the german refill method or could it be damaged while I washed the carts out ?

I took out the false reading cart and drew the rest of the ink off, replaced the cart and the printer still says its full !! I have since refilled it to full to make sure I dont burn the print head. I think, i know for sure it was saying empty befor I reset it.

martop

The ink level sensor works on the frequency of the firings of each of the nozzles.....the prism only comes in to action if the cart loses all its ink through leakage , not electronically firing.

What I suspect has happened in the case of the magenta is that it is not half full because of frequent firings but because the sponge has absorbed half of the resevoir ( just after you placed it in the machine ) due to it being "thirsty".....or the cart has been leaking (unlikely).

Because the level works in this way it is possible to get the reverse of your problem.......i.e. the monitor shows half full but physically the cart is full.
Because of the hap hazard way i use the resetter and keep the carts topped up , some of my carts never match the Level Monitor diagram.
Hope this helps.

 

[martop]

Thanks for the reply,

I have been reading all sorts of info about the way the printer monitors the ink so I took the cart out, drained the ink out so it was empty, placed in back and the printer said it was still full even though it had no inkl. turned the printer off for a few minutes and then printed a text page, still said it was full !! Does this restter actualy allow the ink level to be monitored or does it by pass it to allow the ink cart to be refilled.... ? If I had have carried on printing without checking this cart I would possibly damaged the print head :-((

Martop

 

[martop]

Just done a test, I drained the ink from the yellow cart ( chose at random ) and the printer says its still full, so thats the magenta and the yellow that are not detected as empty.

This printer is the ip4300 and has never had the ignore warnings by-passed so I think its safe to conclude either of two things:

The redsetter does reset the chips but only allows the ink level to stick at full

or more probable

Canon has devised a method to disable the optical sensors once a cart is reset, if this is the case then there are a lot of people who will eventualy run on empty carts and burn the print head.

this could be a very sad day for refillers. I wonder does this only apply to the ip4300 or does it effect the ip4500 as well.

martop

 

[pebe]

Your problem is probably caused as Headphonesman described. I bought empty carts on Ebay and every drop of usable ink in the sponge had been used. Consequently, when I refilled using the German method and turned the cart right way up, the ink level dropped by about 30% within a minute while the sponge soaked up the ink.

I now refill in two stages. First, fill the cart using the german method and with the needle still in place, turn the cart the right way up.

Leave until the level in the tank has dropped and stabilised. Then turn over again and refill to top up.

 

[headphonesman]

The redsetter does reset the chips but only allows the ink level to stick at full

or more probable

Canon has devised a method to disable the optical sensors once a cart is reset,
martop

The Redsetter does reset the chips and does re-enable/or maintain Ink Level Monitoring in the Printer Status Monitor. How accurate the shown levels are according to use is at best just a rough guide. The levels do not stick, they eventually move. Providing the Printer with "proper" carts means that you are not overriding the Ink Level Monitor and so avoiding any warranty infringement on a new machine.

The prism `s ability as an emergency ink empty indicator is open to question. I do not believe Canon have actively stopped its ability to work. I think the Prism probably became redundant when the Chip became the main monitor of ink levels. I would not rely on the prism on a chipped machine.

People who own a redsetter and refill are probably doing it frequently , therefore they should carry out an examination of the carts between the Reset and Refill times , ideally everytime you refill to full you can also reset the cart to full ,even if previously, (for whatever the reason), it was showing a level that was less than full.
All ink running out warnings on my reset carts have occurred when the carts still had plenty of ink , (because of my frequent topping up and not bothering to reset to full ) , I do not therefore have to watch for running the head dry.l

 

[martop]

Thanks for the replies, very usefull information provided as usual

I am like a dog with a bone with this one so before I start chasing my tail and becoming confused this is what I have done ( long day yesterday and I may have missed sometihng ! )

The magenta showed full in the monitor but in fact was almost empty, by that I mean I could see the prism in the tank, at that point I wondered why the prism detecting part never showed an empty cart. like a fool I realised that the magenta ink may not have been full to begin with, as suggested the sponge could have soaked a lot of the ink up once the cart had settled, this explains why it was almost empty when the other carts seemed almost full, I need to improve my filling technique !!

Refilling that cart with ink and NOT resetting it then printing off a few pages did in fact show the ink level monitor working as the leven jumped from full to a quarter empty, so that part works fine.

However this optical sensor does not work as empty reset carts are shown as full on my printer, very strange. I did email the vendor of the redsetter with a question about this but the chap emailed back saying it was because I had disabled the ink level monitor when I re used the carts.... errr no I did not as I have either used the armour cradle or new oem carts ! no deactivated ink monitor here So in theory the printer should be working including the optical sensor for empty carts, as stated this is possibly some to of fail safe in case the tank leaks and empties the cart befor the chip has counted the number of print bursts.

I am really reluctant to open a new set of oem carts to test this optical sensor, I was going to install a new set and then drain one off as a test but that would mean having two sets open.

Thanks for the relies, each has helped me understand the way this works and showed the error or my ways by not fully filling a cart, but I was so excited by the prospect to do refills I forgot to wait till the sponge had taken the ink !!

Back to trying to solve the empty problem, some would say that if the chip is reset and works thne why worry about the optical sensor, very true but in theory it should work unless canon have found a way to disable that sensor when a reset cart is used leaving the printer open to damage if a fault happened and the cart leaked, knowing the methods canon devised to prevent refilling then this would not surprise me at all.


martop

 

[pebe]

It is possible that Canon decided not to use the optical sensor once they had introduced the chip.

But they must have been always been aware of the possibility of government action against them for limiting the users' rights to refill - hence the prisms still moulded into the chipped carts.

I suspect that had there been legislation against them, they would have offered a firmware upgrade to fall back on the optical sensor.

 

[martop]

Have tested this with a new set of oem canon carts, shame to unseal them but... First, installed the new carts then once the printer had settled down I printed 2 test pages.

I then took the yellow cart chose at random and drained it with a syringe and bung...

as the image shows the cart is now empty, simulating a leak.

The ip4300 still sees this as full so the optical sensor either does not work to detect ink level or it never worked in my printer ( knowing my luck......., )

Maybe its used to count the carts because I left the cart out while draining and the print head cradle returned to the right side with the amber light flashing, guess I will never know but I do know that UE law supposed ot outlaw preventing functionality with refurbed carts. At least i know its a useless add on that may work in some printers but not in this one. My old hp920 is still going strong and has been refilled many times, even that knows when a carts half empty !

Anyway I replaced the refilled and reset carts and fixed the orange clip to the oem ones, taped over the air vent ( after refilling the yellow using the top fill method this time ) and taping over that, wrapped the body of each cart in cling film making sure none of it went near the chip and have stored them in thier box top side up as they would be in the printer, would that be enough to store them or have I missed something ?


Thanks again,

martop

 

[headphonesman]

Anyway I replaced the refilled and reset carts and fixed the orange clip to the oem ones, taped over the air vent ( after refilling the yellow using the top fill method this time ) and taping over that, wrapped the body of each cart in cling film making sure none of it went near the chip and have stored them in thier box top side up as they would be in the printer, would that be enough to store them or have I missed something ?


Thanks again,

martop

The cart you show in the picture is not quite empty.......... yet............(only the resevoir compartment)...there is a residue in the sponge which will last some time...a fact that may be allowed for by Canon optical sensor procedure before the warning is activated , I am not sure , I do know the best optical sensor you can use is your own pair of eyes , which is what I do.

Your storage methods are perfectly ok , I affix my orange clips using an elastic band to maintain a good seal , consequently I can dispense with taping over the air vent .