Pictures faded horribly after 4 months with Hobbicolors ink ?

[pharmacist]

Yesterday I was invented at a BBQ from my local soccer club, for which I printed a dozen of A3 photo's with all the soccer players on it. The first 9 I printed using genuine Canon CLI-8 ink on Epson Glossy Photo Glossy paper and the last 3 with Hobbicolors ink with a unknown type of Glossy Photo Paper. The first 9 are still as vibrant as on the day I printed them, but the ones from which the pictures have been printed with Hobbicolor ink the faces looked so pale as if the players are victims of a massive vampire attack. The grass field has faded too terribly and now looks like soaked hay.

Is this a problem from the Hobbicolor ink (UW-8) or the combination from ink and photo paper ? I find it rather disturbing the colours are fades so quickly after only 4 months (pictures are exposed to bright but indirect sunlight and behind a plexiglass window). And if this is a problem with the paper, which type of paper should I use to obtain the longest available protection against fading ?

Does someone have similar experiences with hobbicolor ink and how can I prolonge the image quality of my prints for at least 10 years when using Hobbicolor ink or should I change to another type of ink (MIS, Formulabs ?). Or might there be a interaction between ink and paper type (maybe some papers have protecting qualities against ozone and UV-light ?). Can I coat those pictures with a special protection spray against the destructing action of ozone or UV-light ?

 

[Grandad35]

pharmacist,

Read (http://www.nifty-stuff.com/docs/inkjet-fading.php) and (http://www.nifty-stuff.com/docs/inkjet-fading1.php). These tests show that Canon's ink clearly lasts longer than any of the 3rd party inks that we tested (which did not include Hobbicolor). The UV test procedure is simple and only takes about a week, so you can easily run your own UV fading tests to see how Hobbicolor compares.

These documents also show the effect of various types of paper (nanoporous vs. swellable) and coatings - there can be huge differences when the fading is caused by gasses (0zone, etc.).

Canon claims that their CLI-8 inks have even better longevity than the BCI-6 inks that we tested, and this introduces yet another variable.

We contacted several 3rd party ink suppliers about improving the longevity of their inks. We were told that this would increase their costs and that very few of their customers care about longevity but they DO care about the price of ink. We did a non-scientific poll, and I have to admit that they are correct. One of the main reasons may be that those who really need longevity tend to be professionals, and they tend to use OEM ink (they can charge enough for their prints so that they can afford to pay more for the ink).

Good luck.

 

[pharmacist]

Fading on the long term is inevitable and more pronounced with aftermarket inks like Hobbicolor, but only 4 months ago is really annoying quick...... I once tested a cheap brand of refill ink by making stripes on a piece of 4x6 " glossy photopaper with several basic colours (pigment black, photoblack, cyan, magenta, yellow) and covered half of the picture with aluminium foil and adhere the whole thing on the window facing the sun. This was done about 8 months ago. Two months ago I removed this picture and also the aluminium protection (mainly against UV-light) and saw both parts are as bright of colour as the day I applied the ink stripes. There was only a small amount in fading in the magenta colour, but not that immensely drop in colour from the Hobbicolor ink in 4 month time. I think a aftermarket ink should last at least several years before fading is noticable, not 4 months......

Maybe I should try to use coating spray against destruction from UV and especially from oxidative gasses like ozone. Could someone tell me which type of spray is the best for coating glossy photopaper ?

 

[on30trainman]

Pharmacist,
I am also using the Hobbicolors UW8 inks. You just gave me the incentive to do an unscientific fading test. I am going to make stripe test print such as yours with my ip6000D which has the UW8 inks on Kirkland glossy paper, but can't do the pigment black stripe. Since I have both the Swiss and US flavors of the Kirkland paper I will make two test prints. Will cover one half with foil as you did and will place them in a window that gets full afternoon sun. Will let them there while I am away on vacation. When I get back I will check them and report back. I did a somewhat similar test on some prints using the older Hobbicolors BCI-6 inks and did see some noticeable fading in a few weeks exposure. Am interested in the UW-8 performance.
As far as my need for high fade resistance - most of my prints are stored in albums and do not see that much full light. So high priced inks with excellent fade resistance are not a priority.

Steve W.

 

[InkMon]

Photo's I wish to keep I laminate, I have never had fading problems though even those that are just on display unlaminated. The rooms are light and we get a lot of light in the Australian Summer, heat also, I have not tried putting them out in the Sun, It'l probably turn their toes up. I use an Australian supplied ink from Inkbank.com.au and a good brand of photo paper gloss and ungloss(laminated). I think the paper has something to do with it as a cheaper batch I once used absorbed the ink like blotting paper. I think paper absorbtion could be more of a problem that the ink fading. Actually with ordinary paint Yellow suffers the most with fading so maybe it affects some yellows in pigment and ink.

There are a number of different types of ink you can use some even waterproof some glossyer and some standard general purpose its horses for courses.

 

[Tin Ho]

... various types of paper (nanoporous vs. swellable) and coatings

Nanoporous (or microporous) paper are not very good in fade resistance. Most unknown brand name (mostly cheap) photo paper belongs to this type. The Epson Glossy Photopaper belongs to swellable type. It is a top notch brand and a very good paper. Costco used to sell it in 8x10 100 sheet boxes. It was discontinued by Costco when the kirkland brand made in Swiss came out. I saved a box and still have some sheets. Too bad costco doesn't sell it any more. It should be much better in fade resistance than the unknown brand paper. There are many Chinese paper manufacturers as of now. As far as I know they all make nanoporous type of paper. I had used some and their colors were very inconsistant between different brands and some even had white balance problems. They are very cheap. If color white balance is good it can be used for draft printing. Don't expect it to last too long.

 

[pharmacist]

On30trainman,

thanks for your plan to do a fading test with the UW8-ink. Yesterday I printed 2 testprints too and place them on the open wall unprotected. Give me a sign when you are back from vacation, so we can reprint those pictures again (of course on the same the same type of paper and let them dry for 24 hours before scanning), scan these in and publish these on this forum. I'm looking for the results from this test. If the fading is horrible we will contact Dave from Hobbicolors about this problem.

Could someone tell me if I can use diluted hydrogenperoxide (about 3 %) in let's say rubbing alcohol and spray a very thin layer on a printed picture to accelerate/simulate ozone deterioration (since hydrogenperoxide is similar in action as ozone) ? With this agent a accelerated oxidation test can be done in about 24 hours time, if the ink is susceptible to fast fading.

Besides: have a nice vacation !!!

 

[pharmacist]

Ohh, I thought about the situation and I'm now in doubt whether the last 3 pictures were indeed printed with Hobbicolor ink, since after the CLI-8 cartridges went empty and started to use a unknown type of refill ink, since my order of Hobbicolor didn't arrive at that moment and used this ink to overcome the gap. It was in a hurry and needed to print those pictures immediately for displaying. Meanwhile the printer, I printed those pictures with -a Canon IX4000- I sold to a friend of mine who is using this system with a CISS-system with Hobbicolor UW-8 ink in it. She is very happy with it. She printed a A4 picture of a truck her husband is driving with several weeks ago and the picture look just as bright and vivid as on the day she printed it. I could no signs of any fading at all, even the picture is attached to a cupbard in the kitchen with a lot of direct sunlight and cooking fumes. And she uses very cheap discount photo paper...

Whether the ink is Hobbicolor or not, I think it is a good idea to start a peer-to-peer comparison of the UV/Ozone fading effect on Hobbicolor ink. Since I want to see how this ink competes with the original Canon Chromalife 100 inks.

 

[on30trainman]

pharmacist,
I printed my test prints of the C,Y,M & B bands last night - two each on Kirkland Swiss paper and Kirkland US paper - and let them dry overnight. Put one of each in the window today and the other two away for future reference. The ones in the window are half blocked with foil as I think you did. They will remain there for at least two weeks - I will be home for the rest of the week and then on vacation next week. Just checked one of the prints after today's exposure and see no change yet. Probably get some comments from any neighbors that look at the window - it faces the street.

Hopefully you are right about your bad prints not being made with Hobbicolors inks - Dave touts an increased fade resistance with the UW-8 inks.

Steve W.

 

[Tin Ho]

Good experiment. You should also include a set of print using Canon ink. But you probably do not have Canon ink on hand. I will do that part (only Canon ink) with my ip4300. I do not use Hobbicolors ink. I will print with Canon ink only. But I will make 2 sets of prints. One on Canon's photo plus glassy and the 2nd set on Kirkland US made glossy photo paper. I will put them up on my bathroom window. I would like to see if Canon paper is more archival than Kirkland's no name brand paper.