My Next Fast CoreXY Printer : Bambu Labs X1 / P1S Creality K1 Qidi X-MAX 3 ?

[Nifty]

I've mentioned my interest in the "newer" high-speed CoreXY printers, for example:

• Bambu Labs X1 / P1S
• Creality K1
• Qidi X-MAX 3
• etc.

They all seem to have various pros/cons. I like how https://auroratechchannel.com/ has rated some of these printers, and think these factors are pretty important to me:

1. Print Quality and Speed
2. Technology and Hardware/Build Quality
3. Ease of Use (Workflow/UI)
4. Value for Money
5. Ease of Modability / Customization
6. Misc: Open source, connectivity, requires-cloud, etc.

So, I'm curious what you guys think about these printers, features, pros/cons?

 

[Artur5]

If you want my biased opinion, forget about bambus, crealitys and other flashy Chinese stuff.
Build a Voron to get the real thing. ( I'm sure redbrickman will agree ).

 

[Nifty]

I totally get the pros of a Voron, but I'm just not interested in getting that deeply embedded into such a DIY project. I'm at the point where buying a fast machine that just works out of the box is appealing to me.

 

[Redbrickman]

The Voron is a fantastic printer and the experience you gain in building and setting it up really help to understand where to look when prints aren't coming out as good as they should. Its not a simple plug and play machine though.

I have been following the Bambu development lately and I have to say that if I were to start out now I would buy the Bambu P1S with the AMS (Multi Color add on) as it is a fantastic printer for the price and takes away a lot of the tweaking needed in normal 3D printing to get the very best quality.

The P1S can do PLA, ABS ASA and other less common filaments.

Downside - To use the full features of the printer which include sending files from the Bambu Studio or Slicer to the printer, using the camera for a live view, controlling the printer from the Mobile phone app etc. you need to be connected to their servers. Their EULA is so vague as to how they use your data that its anybodys guess.

I won't go into it all here but if you google Security and bambu lab you can find some of the latest info.

Recently there has been a bit of a kick back from users/potential users of Bambu and they have changed the firmware so that when in Local Lan Mode at least one can now send files via your local router to the machine and see the camera live view.

Downside 2 - If you print a file with a lot of colour changes the wastage from purging can end up being more than the finished print.

If I didn't have the Voron I'd be tempted to buy the P1S and run it in Local LAN mode. The P1S gives you most of the features in the X1C at $500 less. The Lidar is the main enhanced feature of the X1C but in reality the layers the P1S put down when set up right are pretty perfect.

From the little research I have done I'd rate the Bambu at the top of your list @Nifty Certainly the Creality seems to have been a quick design in a reaction to the Bambu. Don't know enough about the QIDI to advise.

Rumours have it that there may be a new model out in the Fall so watch the prices of the existing models.
If you can wait that long

 

[Nifty]

@Redbrickman lots of really good points, thanks!!

In fact, I just watched this video before reading your reply and it's reminding me of a lot of the pros of a "bedslingers".

I have been following the Bambu development lately and I have to say that if I were to start out now I would buy the Bambu P1S with the AMS (Multi Color add on) as it is a fantastic printer for the price and takes away a lot of the tweaking needed in normal 3D printing to get the very best quality.

Ya, most people I've read/heard from love their Bambu printers. They aren't perfect, but I've been surprised at how much people fawn over them.

The AMS: I go back and forth between how much it would be "important" to me vs. "fun sometimes".

I won't go into it all here but if you google Security and bambu lab you can find some of the latest info.

Exactly! Lots of really good videos about stuff on the cloud, and I've heard that professionals won't use Bambu because they want to ensure their IP is private (e.g., not in the Bambu cloud).

Rumours have it that there may be a new model out in the Fall so watch the prices of the existing models.
If you can wait that long

Yup, I'm honestly not in a huge rush, and I'm LOVING seeing the competition heat-up and drive innovation up and prices down!

(I'm SUPER curious what Prusa is going to do over the next few years. IMO, if they don't step up their game, they are going to get dusted)

 

[Artur5]

Prusa is facing strong competition, more than they can handle, I suspect. It’s no surprise that a middle sized European company can’t beat the always rising power of the Chinese industry, if only in terms of labor cost and sourcing components.

If you were a regular on Prusa forums, as I’m, you’d know that the last two years they’ve been struggling badly to maintain their current market share. The “birth” of the xy core XL and, to a lesser extent, the new slinger MK4, has been (and it is ) a bumpy ride, to put it mildly. Never ending problems with sourcing components, change after change of the final designs, frustration of many customers who paid full price and months later still haven’t their printers.... Worse still, when finally the machines started to be slowly delivered to the customers, complains about badly assembled units, faulty components, buggy firmware and what not.
Fools rush in, they say.

I’m very satisfied with my Prusa MK3S+. It’s a nice little printer sturdy and reliable, in spite of the dated electronics and limited printing size but, if I were looking today for a new 3D printer I wouldn’t consider the new Prusas MK4 or XL.
On the other part, I dislike and mistrust the Bambu business model, Not only the suspicious need to connect to their servers but the fact that even if it’s a neat product that seems to work well, the customer knows very little about how the printer works and where to look at if something goes wrong, that it will sooner or later. Exactly the opposite of Voron’s totally open source approach,
Long term reliability of hardware/software, availability of spare parts and after sales support with the Bambu, as with many Chinese products, it’s a total incognito that only time will tell. I’d never buy a printer ( Bambu or whatever) under these conditions, even if it was ultra cheap.

So, no new Prusa or Bambu for me. What was left for a reliable/affordable XY core ?. In my book, only Voron. One year ago I knew practically nothing about this project. When I started to dig into it I was discouraged at first, specially about the software setup, all seemed so complicated, but the excellent documentation on Voron web and plenty of youtube videos helped immensely. Yes, it has been a steep and sometimes rough learning curve, but it was well worth the reward in the end. Nowadays my Voron 2.4 sits facing my Prusa MK3S+ on opposite sides of the room and they work together, never quarrelling, like well behaved ladies.

 

[The Hat]

The Voron is a fantastic printer

but the excellent documentation on Voron

I wish you guys would stop with your praise of Voron, your making me wish I’d gone with Redbrickmans recommendation in the first place, I know they are the best but do you have to keep rubbing it in..

Second Class Creality owner..

 

[Artur5]

I suspect that very few Voron users would equal what you achieved with your Crealitys.

 

[Redbrickman]

On the other part, I dislike and mistrust the Bambu business model, Not only the suspicious need to connect to their servers but the fact that even if it’s a neat product that seems to work well, the customer knows very little about how the printer works and where to look at if something goes wrong, that it will sooner or later. Exactly the opposite of Voron’s totally open source approach,
Long term reliability of hardware/software, availability of spare parts and after sales support with the Bambu, as with many Chinese products, it’s a total incognito that only time will tell. I’d never buy a printer ( Bambu or whatever) under these conditions, even if it was ultra cheap.

Several of the people hat started Bambu worked for DJI, and you just have to Google about DJI Drone video feeds and where they ended up

So, no new Prusa or Bambu for me. What was left for a reliable/affordable XY core ?. In my book, only Voron. One year ago I knew practically nothing about this project. When I started to dig into it I was discouraged at first, specially about the software setup, all seemed so complicated, but the excellent documentation on Voron web and plenty of youtube videos helped immensely. Yes, it has been a steep and sometimes rough learning curve, but it was well worth the reward in the end. Nowadays my Voron 2.4 sits facing my Prusa MK3S+ on opposite sides of the room and they work together, never quarrelling, like well behaved ladies.

Congrats @Artur5 at building the Voron. It is certainly a steep learning curve but as you say the support is fantastic and I know without You Tube vids and the Voron Discord channel I would never have took on the building of a Voron.

My next add-on will probably be the new StealthMax filter system for printing ABS and ASA.

 

[Redbrickman]

I wish you guys would stop with your praise of Voron, your making me wish I’d gone with Redbrickmans recommendation in the first place, I know they are the best but do you have to keep rubbing it in..

Second Class Creality owner..

@The Hat Your Creailty family does what you need to do and does it well. The complexity of the Voron is I think only worthwhile if you intend to print ASA or ABS and need very accurate dimensions. Most 3D printers now can print decent quality PLA parts and PLA is still the most used filament by far.

So keep doing what you are doing and enjoy it without the head scratching over firmware and software updates that sometimes irritate me

Now, if you really are wanting to do something new with the Ender 3 you can try the new Orca Slicer, it gets a good name...