Edible inks for canon

[CanonPhreak]

I just got a mailer from weink about their new edible inks. I don't use such myself but I thought I would psot the link for those who may be interested:

http://www.weink.com/ecom/catalog/ultraflo_fd_c_edible_safe_inks_for_canon_4897458.htm

 

[alchemist]

Thanks for the information.
That ink seems like OEM mark-up pricing. The edible inks I made in the past for several vendors cost about $0.01/ml to make in 50gal batches. That would be $1.35 for 135ml, plus $0.50/bottle, packaging, labor,and overhead, or $1.85 STD cost. Add $0.93 for a 50% profit and we have $2.78. Assume Weink marks it up 300%, or $8.24. $16.00 seems out of line.

Alchemist

 

[Grandad35]

Alchemist,

A few months ago, my seat-mate on an airplane trip turned out to be an engineer who had recently worked on designing and installing the equipment to make ink for a major OEM at one of the major US ink suppliers (he wouldn't say which OEM or which ink supplier). He told me that the large volume production cost for dye based (non-edible) inks was about $0.005/ml, about 1/2 of your 50 gal cost.

I didn't post this until now because I wanted a "sanity check" that his figures were realistic. This puts the ink manufacturing cost for the 14 CCs in a Canon BCI-6 cart at about 7 cents. Obviously, there are many other costs that are not included in this value, but it's easy to see why OEM replacement cartridges are a VERY profitable business.

 

[hpnetserver]

The salary and compensation package for their execitives is probably the main part of their cost in making ink. Just a thought. Cost of the bottle of a bottle of perfume is probably far more than the cost of the perfume itself. The liquid inside a bottle of California red wine is probably less than 30 maybe 50 cents. But unfortunately it always cost me a lot more to just taste a glass of it. There is no question that paying $11 for 14 cc of ink in a pastic box is way too much. But whether it cost more or less than 7 cents to make one is not very meaningful. The saleman who collects money from you and hands you such a cartridge probably makes more than 7 cents from the transaction already.

 

[CanonPhreak]

To all those commenting about prices:

First off I just use weink inks, I have no association with the company. I talk with John Mills regularly on their toll free support line (for which they are paying) and do not find that the prices are in excess of the additional service and product benefits they offer me.

With that said, so what if you can make the inks for so little in material costs. It is the non-material costs,employees, advertising, support, other overhead, warranties, litigation [the US pastime], that adds to that cost, and the company providing the product still has to turn a profit.

As far as I know weink does not make ANY of their inks, they pay a premium to a company with the expertise to make a consist and reliable product for them. weink's job is to make the product work reliably and consistely for you. Obviously that has no value to you or such comments about prices would not be posted.

I will agree that weink is a little more expensive at face value than other companies, but other than my first purchase with them I have yet to pay full face value. I consistently get 10% off because I'm a VIP member with them and take advantage of the better specials they offer through their regular newsletter mailings.

I have also tried MIS, Media Street, Inkjet Goodies, Repeat-o-type, and Mr. Inkjet over the last 8 years I've owned inkjet printers, so I can make a call about them all. weink has provided me with a consistent ink product for my CRS on the 3 canons and 1 epson inkjet I use regularly for the past two years (I purchased all the current CRS I use from them). When I had a problem they took care of it quickly, mainly because they were willing to take the time (on a toll free line) to help me diagnose the problem, I did not get that kind of service from those other companies, often even receiving no replies from simple e-mail questions.

John, at weink, even called me direct after one e-mail I sent because he said that the issue was too complex to be addressed in an e-mail reply. I have never gotten that kind of service from any other company, including Canon and Epson. I have used CIS from other companies before switching to weink and never got that kind of service from them when the CIS finally developed a problem.

This kind of service was not provided free of charge, it is built into the price of their products. All those other companies offered similar support claims but only weink actually delivered on such claims.

I checked the prices of edible inks (google search) from 3 other companies. weink actually charges less, by volume, than all three. They were charging $10-12 dollars for a 2 ounce bottle. weink charges $16.99 for a 4.6 ounce bottle which comes to about $7.40 for 2 ounces. BTW weink sells the same product through their self-service website for $14.99 which brings the 2 ounce price down to $6.52. Fortunately, if I ever have a need to decorate cakes, I know that I can trust weink to give me a ready product that I can use and get support for AND pay even less than those prices.

I suppose I could buy the components and make my own inks (edible or not), but I have better things to do with my valuable time. I don't have a problem paying for inks as long as I get a consistent quality.

In the end I guess what I'm saying is that like every other product in the market, sure I could probably find it cheaper elsewhere or make it myself for far less, but I would rather rely on getting what I buy from some place that has people that know more about it than I do. I certainly wouldn't want to try to build my own inkjet printer, why in heavens name would I want to make my own ink.

I mean I could hunt for my food every day rather than buying from the grocery store, but the grocery store has it ready to cook.

 

[CanonPhreak]

Just to prove my point in my last post:

I got this just a few minutes ago from a mailing from weink's newsletter list:

15%-20% OFF Sale On Select Inkjet Products
Valid with any order placed at WeInk.com. Limit one discount per order. Minimum order $100.00. Offer expires end of day March 13, 2006. Not valid with clearance of overstock products.
15% OFF

Coupon Code: YMLP637

Inkjet Related Supplies Found in the Following Product Departments:

Bulk Ink - Bottled
EconoFLO Build your CRS
Cartridge Empties & Blanks
Canon Replacement Print Heads (allow up to 4 weeks for delivery)
Inkjet Cartridges (Responsible Brand and CRU brand)
Manual Refill Kits for Canon
Manual Refill Kits for Epson

Place your order by Phone on Saturday, Sunday or Monday before 12 noon and we will increase your discount to 20% OFF and include FREE Standard s/h via UPS or USPS. (Shipping offer for Domestic US customers only). Provide coupon code at the time of order.

See I never pay full price.

 

[Osage]

I have to agree with CanonPhreak,

Customer service and confidence in your supplier is very important---at least to me.

And at the end of the day does it matter if you are buying ink at a rate of $100 or $400 a gallon-----when Canon wants to charge you $4300.

Maybe to a high volume user it may matter more---but for a lower volume user like myself, I will pay more for better service and a supplier that answers my questions in a timely manner.

 

[alchemist]

I agree that service and a fair price are all we can expect. Quality ink manufacturers like Image Specialist, AIJ, Graphic Utilities, and OCP provide that all the time. That is all that one can expect.

Alchemist

 

[alchemist]

CanonPhreak,

Several additional comments after re-reading your posting:
Quality,product safety, non-imfringement,and product support are important to me.
The edible inks are the easiest inks to make since there is no concern for archivability or printing on muliple medias. Most all manufacturers use very inexpensive FDA approved food grade dyes (normally 75 to 80% of the cost of materials). My point is that for a high quality product the prices you mention are expensive and I work with a large group of companies in the industry, manufacturers and retailers and have a pretty good understanding of the market.

Alchemist

 

[RC]

The problem is with the aftermarket ink manufacturers.

If they were intelligent they would go on forums such as this one, and see that the problem is with printer profiles matching their ink.

If I was running one of the major ink companies, I would make sure that I had printer profile available for anyone using my ink.

That does not mean that one would have to create a profile for every paper type available, but at least the major ones, such as: Kirkland and some other very popular ones that save the consumer some money.

I have mentioned this to Formulabs, which I think is a great quality ink, but in one ear and out the other.

I have read many messages on this forum, where some users have stopped using aftermarket inks just because they could not get the right color balance.

All these manufacturers have to do is post a couple of good quality profiles, and Canon, HP, Epson and some others would quiver in their pants, but I guess that is to simple for some of these marketing masterminds.

HP, Canon and others are not making money because they are to smart, it is because the aftermarket manufacturers are extremely ignorant. It is not that great of an expense for them to make profiles available to the public, the return will be much greater, as Canon HP and Epson have proved.

Robert