After days of research, can the carts for these printers be refilled?

[Cur10us]

I've really looked hard into what printer to buy, and my head is about to impload because I really need to buy one asap as my trusty hp720 died a week ago [shush t'was an awesome little printer - but soooo slow].

I print about 100 sheets of colour a week. The 720 had an excellent print finish imo, and I don't need anything with flashing lights or an all in one mega machine [although I would consider one around the 50/60 mark IF it's guaranteed to refill easily without too many problems, and is fairly nippy when printing - NOTE: I consider anything faster than the HP720 ie: 4ppm colour, to be fairly nippy]

I want something that is easy, quick and cheap to refill and that actually can be refilled, not one that just accepts compatibles. The general consensus of "oh, the compatibles are only 1 each to replace, so why bother refilling?" is not acceptable for me, it's refilling or not at all.

Based on a week of research and hair pulling, it seems like a canon or epson are wises choices, especially the cannon i3000, i4000, and i5000, which is great if you can find them second hand - but thats not possible for me in my area. If you can link me to a new one I can buy online right now, then youd be my knight in shining armour. I also would consider the Epson R285 [or was it 265, can't remember], but then there's the whole preMarch 2007 thing to establish, and I can't guarantee easy refilling - I like the idea of the CISS thing very much though.

So, on the grounds of health and safety to my loved ones [no printer = bear with sore head for a week = major grumpiness], I've decided to settle on something really basic, - the Epson Stylus 92, or maybe the Canon iP1800 - unless anyone here has any other printer to prescibe me before my family completely dis-own me. I was happy with the HP720 - except for the speed, so a basic model that also accomodates photoprinting will more than suffice. [although the facility to disc print would be a major added bonus]



So, to summarise.
1. Are the carts for the 2 printers I linked easy to refill with refill kits [like my HP 23/57 carts were?], and do both of the printers accept those refilled carts ok? - I'll quite happily pay for a zapper if necessary

2. Are there any known issues with refilling them, or is it relatively plain sailing

3. Can anyone link me to a better idea for a printer [like the i3000, i4000], that suits my refilling needs, that i can purchase now, online?


Also, I'd just like to say that I havent just posted this through laziness, I really have been searching and learning all week. The only thing I can't seem to get a clear grasp on is whether carts for the above printers are refillable. Ink Cart sites have been happy to tell me that the printers accept their compatibles, but not whether their, or the OEM carts can be refilled, and that the printers accept the carts once refilled.

HELP forumers, you're my only hope for a straight answer!

 

[Cur10us]

So, from a guy on ebay, who specialises in cartridge compatibles apparently. I asked if it were possible to refill the cartridges of the Epson D92 and canon ip3300

his response to the D92...
Unfortunately you can't refill these cartridges.

hmn


and in response to the canon iP3300

not sure whether you can refill these as well


No matter how much research you do, it's really hard to gather opinions and information you can trust :/

 

[fotofreek]

The ip3300 is refillable. better to go for an ip4200, 4300 or 4500. These have four dye based carts plus one pigment based cart for text (plain paper setting). They are definitely refillable, but you lose your warranty and ink monitoring by refilling. The carts are chipped, and once they register as empty they can not be reset to tell the printer they are new carts. If you do go with one of these, come back to the forum and read up on how to refill and reseal the fill hole on bci-6 carts, the non chipped carts for the ip4000, etc. Same technique exactly. Because aftermarket carts for these require that you transplant the chip from the Canon cart to be accepted by the printer, you will need to refill OEM Canon carts. Eventually you will need a second set to use while you refill the ones you empty and remove. You will also need to review the purging technique that washes old ink out of a cart after several refills and renews it for more refills.

 

[Cur10us]

Well, many, many thanks for that.

I've reserved an ip4300 at argos - seems to be the same price as everywhere else if you include postage, and I can also pick it up today.

I shall definitely be back to follow the refill guides [which I've read 100 times already, but will probably need to read another 100 before it all goes in ]

It's great to have all this information in one place ... a great forum. Cheers for the help!

 

[fotofreek]

Cur10s - It takes a few filling sessions to get up to speed. Don't be discouraged with initial inky fingers (I use latex exam gloves), a bit of ink on your work surface (don't start out refilling on top of your grand piano over an antique oriental carpet while wearing your best suit), and the feeling that you have all thumbs. It gets easier, faster, and neater with a little experience.

 

[Cur10us]

Well, I have a full box of those gloves, so I guess I'm on the way!

I kinda got set up with a system for filling those old HP23 and 57 carts, and used to do it on a formica tray I could just wipe spillages off real easy, and I could move it from place to place easily and keep all the mess contained. I quite enjoy messing around with this kinda stuff, so after reading lots of these threads [and other sites that go into the CIS systems] I'm looking forward to fiddling with the carts.

As for the new printer, well, I set it all up this afternoon, and I'm mightily impressed! Print speed is supadoopa fast!

Also, its got some really neat features and I like that it's a decent photoprinter, rather than just an all-in-one average at everything.

I must say that when researching printers/carts/refills/performance etc its a pretty hard slog to formulate an informed choice unless you're already familiar with what chips, print heads and filling systems are etc. Simple things like epson chips are not the same thing as the chips on the OEM carts for the canon. It's really hard to piece it all together and make sense. Your comment earlier about chips didn't make much sense to me this morning, and after reading info on the 4300's ability to accept nonOEM's I've swung from mild panic - when it was infered that the printer simply wouldn't print EVER after being refilled once the printer has detected carts as empty, to euphoric joy when it dawned that it's at that point you have to void the warranty and you're then on your own with making sure you don't run out of ink and ruin your printheads [which incidently I had assumed that "oh if that ever happens to me i'll be able to buy a replacement on ebay for 5 or something", .. yeeeah riight - I'll be avoiding that one like the plague, me thinks!].

So, my knowledge is a little less sketchy than it was, and it's improving hourly .. and my heart rate has been up and down depending on my misinterpretation of what I'm reading, and then clarity as my brain catches up half an hour later.

So, after setting this one up while re-reading your threads about refilling carts, I made a conscious effort to actually understand things as I was handling everything [from print heads, to holes in the carts and such] so that when I need to refill, things will be much more self explanatory.

I think you lot have turned me into a printer geek ! I'm pretty tech competent generally - or at least I can usually problem solve my pc when I need to, but I've not really paid much attention to printers before - my HP720 never failed me, so I've never needed to - it was just those pesky HP23 carts and their bloody yellow refusing to print after being refilled that ever caused me problems.

I do like to understand how things work though, and not rely on someone else to do my refills, so I checked around various sites about CIS systems for the ip4300. Youtube [previously only used for viewing people doing silly things on camera, and other less wholesome things] has been another printing education for me!

see here, 1, 2 and 3 and here for cart nerdiness. The last one being in reference to those German chip replacements adapters for the Canon chipped carts, which I saw someone mentioned in a thread here, but I can't remember which one, so I'm posting it here.

I guess my only real concerns are around what seems to be the chip reliability and possibly erratic performance of the cart acceptance after youve voided the warranty - ie: random colours deciding not to print and that sort of thing [edit: though, it seems to me these problems occur more because of issues with incorrect or messy refilling or because the cart is faulty, or has other issues created when refilled, and not because of the chips]. Although I don't mind fiddling with carts, I don't want to be in a position of having a printer I have to fiddle with weekly, because that will drive me insane.

I'm quite happy to check my ink levels daily or whatever, to avoid burning the print head.

I have a few questions regarding maintenance for my printer too, but I'll leave those for another day because I've had my printer fill for one day.

If there's a really well functioning CIS for this printer [which there doesn't seem to be atm], or a chip adapter that becomes reliably available and that works, I'll definitely be interested in both.

Once again, thanks a lot for the advice. I'll definitely be sticking around and re-reading the threads I've seen on problem solving cart woes.

 

[Cur10us]

And one last thing regarding reliable information.

Regarding the questions I asked 2 separate sellers on ebay about the epson D92 and whether the carts can be refilled.

From the guy I quoted in my 2nd post here
Unfortunately you can't refill these cartridges.

and from another guy on ebay, who I asked the same question [both apparantly printer experts]
These are brand new compatible cartridges which you could refill but i would just buy another set at these prices because i think new is far better than refill but its your decision

these kinda comments can seriously send you on a very circular printer hunt and quite easily round the bend in frustration!

 

[Trigger 37]

Wow,.... laugh out loud..... Let me see,... if I ask a guy on eBay that sells stuff,... can I bypass your business by just refilling the ink carts,... Huuummmm. i wonder what he would say..... Ha Ha Ha,...I needed a laugh today...

CurIOus,... at least you got some good answers at this web site.

 

[fotofreek]

Cur10s - I've read of Canon OEM carts that have not been refilled being rejected from the printer without reaching the low or empty state! I think that Canon has made a mistake by injecting a variable in the functioning of these printers that can be glitchy at times.

 

[Cur10us]

Wow,.... laugh out loud..... Let me see,... if I ask a guy on eBay that sells stuff,... can I bypass your business by just refilling the ink carts,... Huuummmm. i wonder what he would say..... Ha Ha Ha,...I needed a laugh today...

CurIOus,... at least you got some good answers at this web site.

Advising me that it would be in my best interest to just buy new compatibles I would expect - no problem with that at all - he told the truth and then tried to sway me into his way of thinking .. smart businessman [esp, since as you say, I was being pretty cheeky asking a question which would essentially make him redundant]

BUT

the first person who answered that the carts simply could not be refilled is either just really stupid [for a printing *expert*], or just lying in the hope that I'll buy his compatibles - it's pretty stupid business behaviour to lie to your potential future customers, no matter how cheeky the question they are asking - I was enquiring about actually buying the printer from him btw, on the strength of the carts being refillable.

either way, my point was more about the confusing responses to someone just trying to gather info and make an informed choice - it's damned near impossible.

which is why this place rocks.

Cur10s - I've read of Canon OEM carts that have not been refilled being rejected from the printer without reaching the low or empty state! I think that Canon has made a mistake by injecting a variable in the functioning of these printers that can be glitchy at times.

see, now it's comments like this that scare the crap out of me!

So, I could go ahead and refill the OEM carts, void the warranty and then the carts never work again because of Canon's retarded technology, and then have a printer which wont accept OEM's, refillables or a CIS through no fault of my own, but not be able to do a damn thing about it.

Serious 2nd thoughts about purchasing now. I had assumed that once I'd taken the plunge and voided the warrantly, that the printer woud just accept the refilled OEM's [by overiding the low ink message - or whatever it is], and that would be it - I'm just left taking the risk about running on empty and possibly burning the printheads. - or left with non print issues due to my poor refilling technique or other blockage issues, which I thoughts I'd probably be able to solve myself also, so I didn't really have a problem if my printer came up with those type of issues.

Problems with it accepting IT'S OWN GENUINE CARTS to begin with, ONTOP of going it alone without a warranty is definitely a concern and throws up more what if's and possibles. urgh.

I think I'm gonna buy a prayer mat to compliment my new printer, maybe that will save me?

[edit]
I guess my only hope is that if my printer has this problem, it's going to happen *before* I void the warranty, and I'm thinking that if the chips dont have a problem now, that they'll be okay after refilling too [hopefully, fingers crossed, touch wood, *prays on prayer mat*]

LIE TO ME AND TELL ME THAT EVERYTHING WILL BE OKAY! or it'll be tears and tantrums for the next 2 weeks in anticipation of the oncoming mayhem that will ensue!

[edit x 10]
my english is beating me this morning