Refilling

wilko said:

I've been refilling carts since the days of the IP4000 and have used the "German" method to refill OEM carts and saved upteen amounts of cash, so I've no real complaints about the refilling method I have used.

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The main disadvantage of "german method" is when you want to flush the cartridge with water, from time to time, to keep the internal sponge(s) in good condition, or if you want to remove completly the old ink to put a new one.

With the "top" method, it is very easy.
Moreover, you don't have to drill the Canon OEM cartridge, there is already an 4mm hole, closed with a ball, very easy to remove (no glue), so . . .

Palatino said:

The main disadvantage of "german method" is when you want to flush the cartridge with water, from time to time

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If you are flushing then maybe something else is at issue. I use the Durchstich method of refilling my CLI-8 cartridges and haven't flushed one in years. I am not a prolific printer like King @jimbo123 either. My printer went dormant for 7 months once and all cartridges, still in the print head during storage, worked. I only use one set of cartridges, the other set and spares in dry dock for years.

For complete disclosure, a year after using my printer once again, the olf Magenta cartridge had flow issues. I replaced it with an old flushed, dry as a bone empty cartridge. It took a few days after filling for the ink to properly saturate the sponge, but it did without human interference.

Long ago I did flush some cartridges. Some were flushed without further modification and the flush water shot out the Durchstich hole and the manufacturer's air hole on the top of the cartridge. I have seen people use syringes to push-pull flush water in-out the cartridge but I never tried it.

Years ago I drilled or tapped a hole in the top of some of the cartridges - exactly what you would do for top filling - and flushed the cartridge . Yes, it seemed a bit easier overall, or maybe it took a little less time, but not so much as to require the top hole for flushing if you use the Durchstich method.

BTW, I still use a many year's old cartridge with a silicon plug on the top and another old one with hot glue gun sealed hole on top. The hot glue gun seal has remained patent for years. I suppose now that I've said that all Hades will break out.

Of course, in this particular matter it only matters what each of us thinks.

in the almost 10 years i've been refilling w the German method i have never flushed/purged a single ink cart. when they start streaking i just put in a new one, taking the "path of least effort"...

here are some of my MP830 PGI5/CLI8 numbers:

319 refills - over 4 PGI5 carts
88 refills - original CLI8-BLACK cart
114 refills - over 2 CLI8-YELLOW carts
129 refills - original CLI8-MAGENTA cart
123 refills - over 3 CLI8-CYAN carts

i only use one set of carts. when one gets low, i remove/refill/reset them all. i print daily and leave the printer on 24x7.

my thoughts are much like printers, once ink carts are unsealed they do best when constantly being used.

J

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• Active Printers: MP830, MP980, PRO-100
• Stored Printers: MP830, IP4500, MX700, MX860, MX870
• Method: German Durchstich Method
• Ink: Hobbicolors and OCP
• Misc: Squeeze bottles - so much easier than syringes

As expected opinion is split on this. The frailty of Canon print heads doesn't help this discussion. The loss of a Canon IP4500 is almost as bad as losing a relative (Just joking). Purists may decry the use of ARC carts but the quality is so much better than it used to be and I've not had one problem with my IP7200 so far. My IP4500 is responding just as well with ARC carts but I will be the the first to admit I was wrong if I encounter problems with my IP4500.

Please give me some leeway. I do a lot of duplex printing and I've had more than my money's worth by refilling OEM carts for several years.

It may be that there is no sure way to ensure print head failure but it just feels more comfortable, to me, refilling carts from the top and watching ink flow through to the sponge.

I suppose I am alone in this. Most experts on here still recommend using OEM carts for whatever refilling method they support.

They are probably right but I'm going with my ARC carts just to see if it prolongs my print head life. After all what have I got to lose?

As an aside. There was a previous discussion about the longevity of print head storage.

I've installed a print head which had been stored for 9 years, with no problems which suggests that unopened print heads have a long life cycle.

Good luck to all refillers.

wilko said:

I'm going with my ARC carts just to see if it prolongs my print head life.

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Why do you think ARC cartridges will prolong the life of a print head?

wilko said:

Purists may decry the use of ARC carts but the quality is so much better than it used to be

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I do not consider purity the test of best. There is nothing that is known to be better constructed and functioning than an OEM Canon cartridge. If you can get a chip resetter then refilling an OEM Canon cartridge is the best way to ensure print head longevity against ink starvation other than new OEM Canon cartridges and probably new, prefilled, high quality, single use only 3rd party cartridges.

If you want or must use 3rd party cartridges then OK. Just realize the risk of malfunction may be increased compared to an OEM Canon cartridge. Tolerance to risk is a factor if there is a choice in cartridge use and also if you are essentially forced to use non-OEM cartridges.

As far as ARC chips versus OEM Canon resettable chips -- I have no data to compare reliability other than the type of ARC chip that does not allow early refilling, in other words, does not allow for a reset before it is marked as empty. The main issue with this (all things being equal otherwise) is wasting more ink due to pulling a cartridge out one at a time for refilling than topping off all cartridges at the same time. Early filling of the waste diaper means early loss of the printer or hassle of replacing / cleaning the diapers. Some will not care, some will.

wilko said:

I've installed a print head which had been stored for 9 years, with no problems which suggests that unopened print heads have a long life cycle.

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Congratulations! It is terrific you had a "fresh" one ready to go.

A properly stored unopened print head may last many years. However, this does not mean a long life cycle. The print head must be used till dead to know its life cycle, unless you are talking production life cycle, which is typically 5 years manufacturer since first released for a Canon print head.

Refilling is personal. It is somewhat opinion driven on the user's end. Whatever feels right in addition to what logically seems correct are the motivators of what we do. Even when we use the same methods for refilling there is variability and is reason some people have more issues than others.

@wilko - Are you taking The Hat up on his generous offer of a free chip resetter? Awfully nice!

The Hat said:

Using a resetter is essential for these carts and if you PM me with your address I will send you a brand new unused resetter for nothing, I have it spare and you might as well make good use of it to protect that marvellous printer.

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stratman said:

If you are flushing then maybe something else is at issue.

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You're right.
Using Sudhaus ink between 2012 and 2016 with my MG5150 (PGI525 / CLI526), I noticed that it was not possible to reach the nominal ink quantity (measured with a 0.1 g scale) as and when of the refillings.
Once flushed, I was able to put the correct amount of ink (full or new CLI-526 = 20.4 g).
So I used to flush the cartridges when needed.

Top refill method performed on over 35,000 carts - using Precision Colors ink on pro 100's - we tried the German method for a while but after watching Jose's and Mike's vids on refilling and cart maintenance in a high volume print environment the top refill method is the easiest with fewest issues.

Using the top refill method using quality ink from Precision Colors we get approx. 25,000 prints per Pro 100 until the waste pads become full and the printer is deemed out of commission.

The best way to keep a printhead from becoming clogged? Keep the printer working...everyday! When we do experience an issue it is always with a poor flowing cart which we simply take it out of our print process... clean/purge it...and its ready for refilling/printing again.

Cymark said:

Top refill method performed on over 35,000 carts - using Precision Colors ink on pro 100's

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Impressive!

Cymark said:

we tried the German method for a while

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Was there an issue that developed with the Durchstich method, and if so, did that issue not occur again after switching over to the top fill method?

There was no issue with the Durchstich method - the key reason for switching back is we refill without any syringes using the top fill method. We use the squezy bottle system offered by PC which is much faster when refilling approx. 200+ carts a day.