Brother MFC 235C insists that Blk cartridge is empty

[Geoffrey]

This printer which uses LC 37 cartridges is causing much grief. First problem was that it ran out of ink after a few but infrequent prints. I now know after searching this forum that frequent head cleaning was the culprit. I then purchased a set of non genuine replacement cartridges, labelled as LC 51, but supposedly compatible with the original LC 37 cartridges. Printer worked OK for a while, then announced that Blk cartridge was empty, however it is still over half full, also reports color cartridges near empty but also more than half full. The printer has defied all attempts to convince it that Black is not empty. I've tried putting black tape over the clear plastic lug that the photo cell looks through, and also refilling the original LC 37BK to no avail. I'm reluctant to spend more money on a new set of genuine LC37 cartridges, cost is nearly as much as the printer. I should have known better buying such a cheapie, but thought that refilling, or using non genuine cartridges would be simple.
I hope someone is able to point me in the right direction here otherwise I'll have to resort to the hammer.
Thanks for a great forum!

 

[tigerwan]

Hi Geoffrey

The LC-51 as far as I can find is not compatible with the Brother MFC 235C. The cartridges have different page yields (LC-51 having more ink) The LC-37 cartridge is Australia, so I'm not sure what the setup is there. Here in Canada we do have the LC-51 cartridges, but not the LC-37. I'm wondering if maybe the installation wasn't done correctly? I don't know if the printer would differentiate from 2 different sized cartridges or not, which is maybe why it is 1/2 full but the printer says empty?

o If you replaced an ink cartridge before the LCD shows Near Empty or Ink Empty, the LCD will ask you to verify that it was a brand new one. (For example, Did You Change Blck?) For each new cartridge you installed, press up navigation key or 1 or "+" to select Yes to automatically reset the ink dot counter for that color. If the ink cartridge you installed is not a brand new one, be sure to press the down navigation key or 2 or "-" to select No.
o If the LCD shows No Cartridge after you install the ink cartridges, check that the ink cartridges are installed properly.

Caution

o DO NOT take out ink cartridges if you do not need to replace them. If you do so, it may reduce the ink quantity and the machine will not know the quantity of ink left in the cartridge.

 

[Geoffrey]

Hi tigerwan

Thanks for your reply. The LC-51 and LC-37 are the same size, but with small differences around the upper and lower edges where they slide into the holder, but seem to fit into the printer properly. The LC 51s have clear case sides and not the removable cases and internal ink bag, nor the air valve arrangement of the LC-37.
The LC-51BK went in when the original LC-37BK said empty, and subsequently the colors when empty, and all was fine for a while. The problem is that ink level indicator for all colours went down again quickly and now BK says empty, colours near empty, but all the cartridges are at least half full still. The machine seems not to be able to tell how much ink is used/left. I didn't see any messages asking to verify whether new cartridge, but I could have missed it! I get "no cartridge" message when I install LC-51BK or refilled LC-37BK cartridge now and message changes to "Black cartridge empty" when I switch off and power up again. Is there some way to reset the counter or otherwise get it to recognise a partly filled cartridge, or to allow me to tell it whether it's a new cartridge or not? I have heard that others have had same problem with similar Brothers, even when using new, genuine cartridges. If I were sure the problem would be solved with new genuine cartridges, I'd get some, but I have a nasty feeling that something else is wrong.
Cheers, Geoff

 

[tigerwan]

There is one fix you can try, put black electrical tape in the clear sides of the LC-51 cartridges, the ink sensor should think the cartridge is full and the error should not return. Just make sure you don't run the cartridges dry.

 

[Geoffrey]

Thanks for trying, tigerwan

Have tried that. Also putting black tape over the tongue the photocell looks through. The printer seems to have "locked up". Even with no carts installed jt still says BK empty and Y, M and C near empty. It's like it needs a software reset. Perhaps it didn't like the LC-51 compatible carts? (they were labelled as LC-37 compatible)

 

[tigerwan]

Maybe.........You could try uninstalling the driver, then unplugging the printer from the computer, and the electricity, wait for 1/2 hour, then restart the computer, plug the printer back into the computer,and electricity, let it auto detect. If you use Windows xp, or Vista, let them install their own driver for the printer, if they have one. If Windows doesn't have a driver, then reinstall the Brother driver. Also make sure you don't approve any automatic update programs, as this is the Manufactures way of shutting down third party cartridges (they update your firmware, and this renders any third party cartridges installed, USELESS).

 

[Geoffrey]

Well, I've tried all I can think of including your advice to uninstall driver etc. to no avail, but thanks, tigerwan, appreciate your effort to help. It seems that Brother may well have shut down third party cartridges, but included their own as well! Do you think it would be worth my while to buy another set of genuine cartridges? If there is still no joy, I might be able to claim warranty on the printer, its only 6 months old. (that's assuming that having tried third party cartridges has not voided the warranty).
cheers
Geoff

 

[tigerwan]

Well, I have heard the Brother (certain models) have a faulty ink sensor problems, I am assuming that this is your problem. Usually the work around fixes this so that you can at least continue to print, but yours doesn't want to cooperate...lol. I would suggest new Brother cartridges, to see if it rectifies the problem, if it doesn't, at least you have OEM cartridges installed so they can't claim warranty breach on you.

 

[Geoffrey]

G'day tigerwan,
Finally resolved the issue. I installed new genuine Brother Blk and nothing changed, printer still reported Bk empty, colors near empty. At this point I spat the dummy and contacted Brother tech support. They agreed there was a problem, suggesting it was to do with a print head, which to me seemed unlikely. It looks more like a software lockup or even a hardware fault in the cartridge detection area. Nothing changes on printer LCD display no matter what I do. The tech said to do a "Purge clean" (press menu, then * then 2864 all within 2 seconds. Nothing happened. Next test was to enter 76 then hit Mono start button, still nothing.). Techo declined to comment about ink usage counter locking up being a problem with some Brothers, but conceded that they are very bad with ink usage with frequent head cleaning. He asked whether new cart was genuine. I said yes but told him I had used non genuine cartridges previously. He conceded that that shouldn't be an issue. Said it definitely was a warranty issue.
The outcome was to return it to the retailer, where I received a full refund for printer and the black cartridge without hassles, so I can't complain about that.
I now need to find a replacement printer. Inclined to go for a mono laser, as I can do without color and don't print very frequently. Are there any major pitfalls with lasers or brands and models to avoid? I'll do some homework before I buy this time!
Thanks again for your input. I've at least learnt a bit about ink jet printers!
cheers
Geoff

 

[freddyzdead]

This is very interesting. I have a Brother DCP-150C which also uses LC-37 cartridges. I liked it so much I bought one for my daughter as well. She called me one day and said that she had replaced some cartridges with off-brand ones, there had been some ink spilled inside the printer, and now it says the black is empty and all the colours are nearly empty. This in spite of the fact she had gone and bought a whole set of genuine LC-37 s and installed them. Nothing changed.

I went over to her place and spent quite awhile confirming that what she said was quite right. I told her it needed a more serious look than I could give it there, and took it home with me.

I suspected that some of the spilled ink may have contaminated the photosensors at the back of the cartridge chamber, so I decided to dismantle it to get a better look. This turned out to be not too easy, but I finally got it open, to find there indeed was ink all over the sensor board. I carefully removed it, took it into the bathroom, and cleaned it up as best as I could. I dried it with a hairdryer and reinstalled it.

To my dismay, the printer still showed black as empty, but one of the colours was no longer reporting nearly empty, so I had at least had some effect.

At this point, I made a hard decision: I decided to swap the sensor board from my printer into hers. Realizing I could end up with two dead printers, I carefully dismantled mine, transplanted the sensor into hers, and reassembled it. Lo and behold, it worked perfectly.

I then did a more thorough cleaning of the ink-stained sensor, washing it in alcohol, then rinsing and drying with hair dryer. I put it back into my printer, reassambled it, and, voila! it worked perfectly.

Now I will tell you my reading of the situation.

Firstly, I think it is an egregious design flaw to have placed such a sensitive component (sensor board) so close to the business end of the ink cartridges. Sooner or later, there is going to be some kind of spill, and that isn't good.

Secondly, there is a fundamental difference between the "foreign" cartaridges and the originals. That is in the air valve at the top rear. The original has a little plunger which is sealed until you click the cartridge in place. The aftermarket ones she used had no plunger, just a hole with a piece of tape over it, which you remove before you put it in. This is probably the source of the leaking.

My advice: Look carefully at any non-Brother cartridge you buy, and make sure it has the little plunger. If it doesn't, then don't buy it.

I can also state that refilling of the LC-37 cartridges is indeed possible, but you had better be prepared to have multi-coloured fingers for awhile after. I used a 20 ml syringe, but I found that the tip wasn't long enough, so I made an extension from a bit of tubing from an old spray-bottle and fixed it on with a blob of molded epoxy putty, the kind of stuff used for emergency radiator repairs and such. Using this, I was able to force it into the exit valve and inject 10 ml of ink. But before you can do that, you must withdraw 10 ml of air. I cannot stress too much how important this is. You won't be able to do it in one go, probably, so you should inject 2 or 3 ml and then turn the cartridge over and suck out the same amount of air. Keep doing this until you have replaced 10 ml of air with ink.

This would be a lot easier if you could see what you are doing, so removing the shell of the cartridge would be highly recommended. Unfortunately, they do not open like a book as is claimed in many places. They are glued together, and the only way to get them apart is to break the seam with a very sharp knife. This is dangerous both for the cartridge and for yourself. But filling it is a breeze when you can fully see the labyrinthine nature of the interior of the cartridge. Even if you decide to do it blind, you should open at least one, so you get a good view of how it's made. Removing the air requires turning the cartridge in counterintuitive directions, so I highly recommend that exercise.

After you've done half a dozen or so, you will be able to do it with only inking up 2 or 3 fingers. The main thing is to be sure there is no positive pressure inside the cartridge, else it will likely go "squirt" when you click it in, whereby you risk contaminating those oh-so-delicate optical sensors. You can push the button if you're not sure (over the sink, of course) and if there is pressure, you will have some coloured fingers. Don't be afraid to wash out the cartridge thoroughly after filling, then shake all the water out and dry it with a paper towel.